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That looks like quite an interesting idea actually. I could possibly make space for a rack on the side so I should look into it more.
Thanks again!

I'll echo what Jim's saying, but also I'd like to point out that the oscillator that's in this build is part of why Mutable's gone now.

Don't give Uli your money when he misbehaves. Like this. It's sort of like training a dog: praise and reward for good behavior.
-- Lugia

Thanks Lugia!
I think I understand what do you mean so I'll try to look for alternatives...any suggestion is welcome!

is the case intellijel? looks like it to me - in which case yes the intellijel 1u tiles are designed to work with their cases... it's part of the sales strategy - buy our cases, fill them with our modules...

-- JimHowell1970

Yeah, you know the drill... I really wish Intellijel hadn't done that; there's a lot of Pulplogic-format tiles that would make an AWESOME pairing with certain Intellijel tiles...but you can't do that without a PL-format row or some other bracket scheme.

And yes, the input and output mixer tiles feed to/from the 1/4" jacks on the 7U cab. They've got backplane connections that everything matches up to.

EDITED Jun 26th 2022, 01:10

Gates on the BSP go to the trigger inputs, yes. Plus, since the Zadar deals with gates by only responding to the initial rise, you can also use LFOs that have a sharp leading edge on their output waveform to trigger the Zadar. Useful!

I'll echo what Jim's saying, but also I'd like to point out that the oscillator that's in this build is part of why Mutable's gone now.

Don't give Uli your money when he misbehaves. Like this. It's sort of like training a dog: praise and reward for good behavior.

Now, who said the mixer had to go on the desk? Check this: https://reverb.com/item/56181294-alesis-multimix-12r-rackmount-12-channel-mixer

Mine's immediately behind me...and it's the dedicated mixer for the lab gear setup. The nice thing about that sort of thing is that you can get a rack case, put this in, put MORE stuff in with it, and now you've got a rack for FX and mixing. Just put it on a stand (like a chair, even) next to you, and save the desk space.

There are lots of suggestions for modulation modules in a recent thread on Modwiggler: https://www.modwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=263375

Thank you very much for helping! I made some change according to your advice. May I ask is there any alternative module for the VCF you recommended? It’s a little bit hard to find in UK, Thanks.

there are 1200+ alternative filters... take a look and pick one with similar characteristics (and maybe check back here based on your selection) or just order one off reverb - it'll arrive, eventually... buying modules unseen from far flung places and waiting and hoping they arrive is part of the thrill of modular...

By the way I have a monome Norns is there a way to interstate it into this system?

I had to look up the monome norns, but then 15 seconds reading the module spec hinted that it may be possible using usb - you will have to read the norns and case specs carefully to see if they will connect - ie whether the case is recognized as a midi device or not - I suspect it is but my suspicions are no substitute for RTFM

And is the 1u mix module capable of connecting the case output? Thanks again.

is the case intellijel? looks like it to me - in which case yes the intellijel 1u tiles are designed to work with their cases... it's part of the sales strategy - buy our cases, fill them with our modules...

Great sale to @FcKw , money arrived super quick :)

Thank you very much for helping! I made some change according to your advice. May I ask is there any alternative module for the VCF you recommended? It’s a little bit hard to find in UK, Thanks. By the way I have a monome Norns is there a way to interstate it into this system? And is the 1u mix module capable of connecting the case output? Thanks again.

Wonderful!

Already happy that I'm avoiding the big mistake as I'm trying to do my best to research what would suits me the best.
For the moment, I'm connecting to a small home studio system with a Scarlett solo.

Many thanks for your feedback!

big mistakes to avoid?

buying modular synthesizers without enough research to know what you are buying...

Do I need outputs and/or mixer or some other modules can do that?

output module: you may or may not need an output module... depends what you are connecting to, most modern mixers and audio interfaces should be able to handle modular levels

mixer is probably too small for this size of case

you probably need more mixers

see my signature for a vague hint at how to build a modular synthesizer with the most variety for the least amount of cash

Hi!
Looking for feedbacks as I am very new and trying to figure out my starting system for some ambient/drone/generative music.
Not sure (of course!) what my objective is besides having a lot of fun but I do like Alessandro Cortini, Aphex Twin, Ginevra Nervi, Helene Vogelsinger...
Anything I should look specifically for? Or big mistakes to avoid?
Do I need outputs and/or mixer or some other modules can do that?

Thanks!

Thanks Lugia will defo try to follow this.i have a zadar so could try that

So connect the gate from BSP to the trigger on zadar or have i gotten that wrong?

EDITED Jun 25th 2022, 12:03

Hi Lugia,

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

An outboard mixer is something I am trying to avoid because I have a tiny desk. But it’s seeming more and more like that’s the cleanest solution :/ so unless another magic solution exists I might just have to look into that.

Re. the Rackbrute, the same friend who lent me the tex mix (and a couple of other modules not on here) sold it to me at a really good price to help me get started. Also I quite like how it looks and the little space under let’s me tuck external cables + the octatrack away nicely.
I’ve also got a 3U rackbrute btw that I’ve not got connected due to the same space problem but if needed I can latch that on later for an extra 84.

Mantis is an absolute bargain though I agree! Was first choice for me till this deal came along and honestly if the space is really a problem with the 3u rackbrute (and if I ever need it) then I may get a mantis and sell the others.

Thanks for your reply :)

I've been thinking recently that we have enough of the proper stuff in Eurorack to create something that's 100% OUT of control. Not generative...but berserk! Some Moffenzeef and Schlappi (THE company that's hellbent on ruining your hearing!) stuff in tandem with that would start getting into the "batshit insane" sonic zone. Would make for a great takealong cab if you were playing an appropriately-chosen live set in some blighted industrial wasteland.

Solution simple: an outboard mixer. It feels like you're trying to get way too much out of the internal mixing strategy, and with all of the other devices, trying to run them through the TexMix is just more complexity added to complexity. Plus, running external equipment then feeding it to the modular's mixer (which is expecting modular-level voltages) probably won't sound all that good in the end. Get your audio summing out of the cab, and then you automatically solve the "drums in cue bus" problem.

Next...unless you've got an Arturia Minibrute 2 or 2s, I don't know why you would use a Rackbrute. They're nice and all, but they restrict you to the Minibrute 2's form factor. Plus...well, looking at Sweetwater here, the 6U Rackbrute goes for $359 at two rows of 88 or 89 hp, depending on who you're listening to. And right next to it is Tiptop's Mantis: $335 for 2 x 104 rows. And if the expandability of the cabs is a future concern, the Mantis can link with a second Mantis via a linking bracket to give you a crazy AF total of 416 hp for $670. Beat THAT deal!

Hmmm...clearly, you either like module programming with a pair of tweezers, or you've got fingers the size of raw spaghetti. The first thing I would suggest is to get all of those little bitty modules the hell OUT of there.

As for more modulation with the existing modules, my suggestion would be to lose the old Veils and replace it with the NEW one. This then opens 2 hp...and you have 8 hp already...for a total of 10 hp. Now head over to Tiptop's listings and check out the MISO. It fits under "mixers", but that's far from everything that that one module can do. And it's versatile enough that you'll be using it all the time for LOTS of things that involve extracting more modulation from your current modulators. Put it right next to that 10 hp Veils so that you can also have CV over modulation amplitude with ease, and there you go.

I can see where this is headed, but without a lot more in the way of "helper" modules, this will be a total PITA to use. I'm also questioning the wisdom of having so many large-sized modules in a small cab, which is part of why you haven't got many of those "helpers" in the build, I would figure. But think...do you REALLY need four effects processors? Really?

Let's fix this....

[SNIP]

OK...most of your main modules are still in there, but I got rid of the superfluous stuff, most notably the excessive amounts of effect processors. I kept the Morphagene because it's more than just a delay module and you appear to want a more granular approach to that aspect. But anyway...

TILES: Stereo input (for which you don't need extra jacks...the cab already has a pair for the input and the output as well), then the MIDI interface. Then I yanked the FX processor that was there because having a noise/random source is much more important, along with the other utilities there such as sample and hold and slewing. The Noise Tools tile can also serve as a master clock, but in this system that can probably be used for other purposes. QuadrATT is next, then I put in a Stereo VCA for a very specific reason related to the NEXT module, the Output Mixer. The VCAs are there so that, if you want to fly a signal in over the mix, you can have CV control over that level. So, if you want the Morphagene's output to slowly emerge from behind the dry signal...well, that's how you do it. And lots more besides.

MIDDLE: Just Friends and Plaits first. Then a Veils to sum down signals from those and control amplitude. Then the next thing...oh, it's just one of the most sought-after filters of all time: the Synton Syrinx, or G-Storm's clone of it. The Syrinx's filter was an elaborate and very expressive thing that was very formant-capable. G-Storm's version also has a 4-channel mono mixer on the input, so if you wanted to mix each preceding Veils channel through that, it's a snap. And after that, Rings...so you've got a formant-capable VCF (a VERY good match with the Just Friends, I should note!) going into a physically-modeled resonator. Sounds right to me! One more Veils after that, then I put in a Toppobrillo Stereomix2 as your performance mixer. This thing gives you CV over channel level, AUX level, and panning per channel. It's got a proper send/return for FX, also...mono out, stereo return, and you get a CUE, mute, and PFL too. Oh, and your headphone preamp there can be switched between the CUE and OUTPUT busses so that if you need to, say, correct tuning mid-set, you can put the offending VCO through the CUE to your headphones so that you can spot-up the tuning. In short...very effective.

BOTTOM: ES-8 and Monome thingy. Then Xaoc's Batumi (with Poti expander), Maths, and then the "modulation manipulation" bit, which uses a Frap 321 to wrangle more modulation out of the modulation and a Happy Nerding 3xVCA to control your modulation levels. Adding those to the modulation scheme actually results in being able to wring out a lot more of other derivative modulation signals. Then, Zadar/Nin...and the Morphagene.

So...this not only has its module complement fixed, the layout also makes far more sense by setting it up this way. Result will be that the rig will be easier/more intuitive to patch as the locations of different types of modules have been consolidated here. And with the "helpers" now in place, this will function far better than the initial build might've.

EDITED Jun 25th 2022, 02:20

On the behalf of totally insane modular synth users worldwide, I'd just like to.....

Nah. Actually, VCV and hardware have their uses. VCV has loads more modules that are ready to go, but you have pretty much ZERO tactile physical patching. And hardware is more limiting (until you crash VCV!) but has the advantage of getting your hands on the sound. But since VCV can be patched up so that it's using external signals, you can go from the physical modular to the virtual one, and take advantage of the best aspects (and worst to some extent...huge VCV patches can get a bit hairy as far as CPU load) of BOTH methods.

Plus there's a method that seems to ALWAYS get missed, and that's combining VCV and physical modulars on an equal basis. Oddly, in Eurorack everyone knows about the voodoo that Expert Sleepers do, but where CV/trig/gate control is concerned beyond their offerings, people know little else, it seems. But if you can snag a DC-coupled "obsolete" audio interface (I use a MOTU 828 mkii), you can use such things as Expert Sleepers' software, CV Tools in Ableton, Volta on the Mac, etc to integrate both system paradigms into one big, complicated and glorious MESS. Plus, yes, you CAN use both CV/g/t AND audio via this method. Just don't run out of channels!

Sure, it doesn't make any sense. But then, try and follow an explanation of Neapolitan 6ths sometimes.

The BSP's gate actually goes somewhere else altogether in a basic patch: an envelope generator.

Gates are basically a "squared envelope". Zero rise and fall rates, though. So what the EG does is to translate that gate pulse into something more like an instrument's physical envelope. So the proper patch would really look more like

(Ok, yeah...it's not patched. MG's patching system seems to have a Firefox issue...? Anyway...)
I used Doepfer stuff here because it's easy to follow, but the same rules apply to any similar combination of modules of this sort.

In order to patch this up to a BeatStep Pro, you would...

1) Connect a BSP CV OUT (whichever channel you prefer) to the CV IN on the VCO.
2) Connect the VCO audio output (or two in this case, since the VCA has a dual input) to the first VCA's audio input(s).
3) Connect the VCA audio OUT to the VCF audio input.
4) Connect the VCF audio OUT to the second VCA's audio input.
5) Connect the second VCA's audio output to a mixer channel for combining with other audio signals for eventual output.

So, that's the audio path. Now, for the modulators, you can see an LFO and two ADSR envelope generators. So...

6) Connect an LFO output to a modulation input on the VCO and use this sparingly for a bit of audio vibrato. You can also add a vibrato to the VCF as well, potentially with a different LFO waveform.
7) Connect the BSP's GATE OUT on the chosen channel to BOTH of the gate inputs on the envelope generators. This now has both ADSRs responding to the same gate signal.
8) Select a decent envelope for your purposes, and then send that to BOTH VCAs.
9) Lastly, use the other ADSR with a shorter and different envelope to modulate the VCF's cutoff frequency.

Basic bass, that. But that's how the BSP's CV sequencers should be patched for basics.

The master of disaster. Awesome.

Hello everyone, first post here and quite new to the Eurorack world so I’m after a bit of advice!

I am having a little bit of a routing headache. For context, my setup is an Elektron Analog Rytm, Analog Four, Octatrack and the Eurorack.

The way I have it set up now is I’ve got my Bitbox + Loquelic going into the Tex Mix (borrowed from a friend) then out via the Master to my Analog 4, and then that goes into AB inputs of my Octatrack.

Then I’ve got the Analog Rytm going into the Tex Mix and the Basimilus taking up the last spot (I prefer not having audio go into the Rytm as the external mixer page is non existent unlike the A4). Those 2 are set to cue, and go from the monitor out of the Tex Mix into inputs CD of the Octatrack.

What I’m trying to achieve is to have the melodic stuff on one side, drums on the other and use the OT as a final mixer/mangler. But as you can see, it’s quite a convoluted and messy set up. Add to that I can’t use send effects with the drum modules as they’re on cue. Is there any better way to do this? I feel like there is there a simple solution I’ve completely overlooked and I’m hoping someone with more experience can help.

My second question is a more general opinion/advice one. I’ve linked my rack so if you can, please give me your thoughts on it and whether you think I’ve omitted something/think there may be something that would be a good addition :)

I mainly use the Eurorack in conjunction with the 3 elektrons so in terms of voices I think I’m pretty covered (though again, I’m new to the modular world and am very open to different perspectives).
I’ve got 10hp free but I’m open to switching, buying, selling etc. The music I make is quite heavy, 100-130bpm EBM/darkwave/techno type stuff though sometimes I do switch it up to some drum n bass/breakbeat if that helps at all.

Thanks very much.

Edit: it’s not showed up yet but I have the mono not stereo tex mix inputs.

EDITED Jun 24th 2022, 21:06

DPO is the bass line, manually sequenced by Pressure Points. Mysteron is the main melody/sequence. Telharmonic runs through Morphagene, filtered through MMG and sequenced by Rene. ErbeVerb is the end-of-chain effect. Moddemix and Optomix were the mixers/VCAs for DPO and Mysteron. Tempi set the clock and clock divisions. Maths doing its envelopes on DPO and Mysteron.
-- pobenergy
tj 4 the expaning

DPO is the bass line, manually sequenced by Pressure Points. Mysteron is the main melody/sequence. Telharmonic runs through Morphagene, filtered through MMG and sequenced by Rene. ErbeVerb is the end-of-chain effect. Moddemix and Optomix were the mixers/VCAs for DPO and Mysteron. Tempi set the clock and clock divisions. Maths doing its envelopes on DPO and Mysteron.

I would ditch Pamela’s and replace it with the NerdSeq More CV expander. I have both and find that the Nerd can do nearly everything Pamela’s can: smooth/stepped random, clock divisions, etc. I’ve been seriously thinking of offloading my Pam’s and I’m a great fan of it. Just feeling it’s a bit redundant.

Wow thanks so much I really appreciate! Gonna take this all to heart and re update this rack thanks a ton

Pamela's New Workout would fit nicely. 8 clockable LFOs , with variations - euclidean, random, logic, quantizing.

I’m quiet happy with my rack but want some more modulation possibilitys.
Mainly for modulation of Plaits, Monsoon and Marbles in generative patches.
I have 8 HP free space and think that DivKid ochd could be a good choice.
But I should be happy for other suggestions.

• Flute, Arbhar, Beads, Morphagene, Desmodus Versio, Planar2, Microcosm

With 1u the clearence for the rails is taken away from the long side of the module, e.g., you have less space to work with compared to a 3u, given the same size front plate.
-- wiggler55550

This also results in more space for your fingers! :)
More below...

You cannot just give a 3u module a quarter turn and declare it a 1u, you will need a new layout to fit it in the narrow space.
-- wiggler55550

Actually, if the module has been properly designed, you can. Be prepared to have quite a wide 1U module though.
Both 3U and 1U versions of my LB5 module use the same PCB, and only have different front panels, so the "lost" area needed for the rails virtually has no impact.

https://www.modulargrid.net/e/xodes-lb5-1u

https://www.modulargrid.net/e/xodes-lb5-3u

About whether a 1U only case makes sense / is a good idea or not (or if the 1U format makes sense at all), will only depend on how one would use it, so there's no universal answer, and it's not for everybody.

Even though the short demo used this case on its own, the idea was more to complement existing setups to add a couple 1U modules. Some are only available in 1U format, some interfaces (like the steppy) are more user friendly / natural with modules in the horizontal orientations, so there can be uses for such cases. And nobody will force anyone to buy one. :)

There were also some similar reactions when I released the 1U/3U adapters, and yet, I always need to make more. I understand that this solution too is not for everyone though.

Another thing to take into account is the type of modules to be used in 1U : the utilities I released earlier this year were originally designed as 1U modules only, and I finally decided to adapt these to 3U (using a specific PCB for each format this time). So far sales are slightly higher for the 1U format, and this was kind of expected, based on what happened with LB5 already. I do apply the same prices for both formats, and that's just the way it should be.

One could also argue about if hardware modular synthesizers in general make any sense in the 21st century when you can use VCVrack instead! ;)
I guess sane people just don't invest in modular synths. :)

Wouldn't it be great if you could send monophonic sequences to each of the channels. Dang, you'd have 8 channels note to CV for instance coming from a DAW...

EDITED Jun 24th 2022, 07:50

That makes sense to me. Thanks for your explanation.

With 1u the clearence for the rails is taken away from the long side of the module, e.g., you have less space to work with compared to a 3u, given the same size front plate. You cannot just give a 3u module a quarter turn and declare it a 1u, you will need a new layout to fit it in the narrow space. I guess that's why my 1u uO_C was so much more expensive than the 3u version. Moreover, the smaller the module the less functionality will fit in while much of the cost will not shrink accordingly.

I was thinking of a more or less self sufficient rack here. But given a special use case it does make sense, I can see that.

But let's face it: The bang for the buck in 1u is less compared to 3u so it's possibly not that good an idea.
-- wiggler55550

While I agree with you given the current lineup of available 1u modules, I could see something like this prompting the creation of more unique and interesting 1u modules.

I like the idea of a 1u only rack for patch specific utilities that I don't always want taking up space in my main rack. Rather than use a 4ms pod or a pico case with a bunch of tiny 2hp modules, I would rather have just a row or two of 1u stuff.

Am I missing some glaring drawback of 1u? In other words, is there a concrete reason for the difference in "bang for the buck?"

kkk

Great device for incurring tinnitus!

I have been toying with the idea of a 1u only rack for a while. And boy does it look cutesy. But let's face it: The bang for the buck in 1u is less compared to 3u so it's possibly not that good an idea.

I'm interested. A wider, more HP, version would be neat too.

just tried to connect the BSP to plaits as descibed above,but i only get real short sounds comin out of Plaits,what im after some some longer Drone sounds,any tips?
-- Broken-Form

then you won't get a continuous sound from plaits - leave this unplugged and plaits will drone (depending on the mode) just like any other oscillator

-- JimHowell1970

aahh nice Thanks Jim

just tried to connect the BSP to plaits as descibed above,but i only get real short sounds comin out of Plaits,what im after some some longer Drone sounds,any tips?
-- Broken-Form

then you won't get a continuous sound from plaits - leave this unplugged and plaits will drone (depending on the mode) just like any other oscillator

just tried to connect the BSP to plaits as descibed above,but i only get real short sounds comin out of Plaits,what im after some some longer Drone sounds,any tips?
-- Broken-Form

don't plug anything into trig or level...
-- JimHowell1970

i plugged the gate from BSP into trigger on Plaits

just tried to connect the BSP to plaits as descibed above,but i only get real short sounds comin out of Plaits,what im after some some longer Drone sounds,any tips?
-- Broken-Form

don't plug anything into trig or level...

just tried to connect the BSP to plaits as descibed above,but i only get real short sounds comin out of Plaits,what im after some some longer Drone sounds,any tips?

How about a commemorative blank panel in honor of Dieter Doepfer?
He go the ball rolling after all.

Hmm...in another 43 new modules, we'll have 10,000 Eurorack listings. Yeah, some of 'em are duplicates, but even so...

I wonder which module's going to get that distinction?

Nah...the Generate3 is more akin to something like Doepfer's A-110-6, where you're dealing with an analog oscillator with a big assortment of modulation inputs. The Odessa is a VERY different critter. Instead of basic VCO topology, you'd be dealing with an FPGA-driven additive engine with the potential of outputting 2500 harmonics (which shocks the hell out of me; I thought that the Synclavier II was the big dawg with 128 partials back in the day!). And with the Hel expander (and it's in there) you can have FIVE VOICES coming out of the Odessa and feed 'em all through the next VCA set to the Linneaus in glorious stereo. The Generate3 absolutely cannot compete with that feature set, and I didn't even get super-deep into all of the Odessa voodoo.

Also, with this, you'll want a controller/sequencer that can take advantage of that voicing scheme...with the best bet there being an Arturia Keystep Pro. It's also flexible enough that you can use it with loads of other devices, too.

thanks a lot for this wonderfull sketch Lugia...

looks amazing...i have some video to check on youtube for those modules !!!!!

odesea was on my list but i was thinking that generate 3 from joranalogue is similar with fund, odd, even its already in my actual case...anyway maybe they can talk to each other really welll....

Recorded some weird ambience today

-- sacguy71
Yes weird is the correct description !!!

Is there a way to create repeating random stepped voltages just like the voltage block?
-- Polyterative

yep. easy

Set an output waveform to random, then set number of beats to loop