Hi Lugia,

Oh that's fantastic, thanks a lot for your reply and providing me a list of "homework" to check out! :-)

A few I considered already like the Instruo Tona and the Intellijel Rubicon II however all the oscillators from your list are all good pointers and it looks like that I have to do a lot of reading, testing, verifying and making the puzzle of oscillators even more difficult but also nice challenging, I like that so no worries there.

A few brands might be difficult to get directly from a dealer here in Europe but I will check them all, especially those I can get here in Europe.

Thanks a lot again and kind regards, Garfield.

Hello All,

I was hoping for a few reactions. Any comments about oscillators, experiences with them (good or less good) is welcome. I am looking for one or two more oscillators and appreciate your input to this matter very much.

Thank you very much in advance and kind regards, Garfield.

I wasn't aware about it either, nice indeed, thanks!

If one logs-in at modulargrid.net, from there how to get to that page without using that link?

Hello Marco,

Thank you very much for being so tolerant with me, that's very kind of you.

I almost check every two or three days or so to see if there is any news regarding Ground Control and the Black Sequencer, can't wait for these modules to arrive in the shops and hopefully can test them. I hope either one of them is going to be my main sequencer :-) Let's see...

What can a dual filter do more than two single filters? Naturally depending on which dual filter, you might be able to mix the two filters' output or keep them strictly separated from each other. Not too sure how you meant your question? Or did you meant if it's worth it to have a dual filter? If that's the case, well I guess like oscillators, envelopes, LFOs, you just can't have enough filters, can you? ;-) Perhaps indeed you could replace the filter you have planned now with a dual filter, that might be indeed a good idea. Or take two different filters, so you get two different characteristics in your music.

Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Martebar,

Ha, ha, sorry, it looks like we used your rack post for other synthesizer stuff discussions ;-)

How is your combination of the just new obtained modules and your 0-coast? Must be good, isn't it? I had now almost two weeks ago the opportunity to test the 0-coast from a good friend in combination with my Eurorack system, oh my, that 0-coast thing is a beauty! I love the sound that comes out of the 0-coast hence I am a bit jealous ;-)

Oh no! Now I also read you got an Octatrack?! I am definitely jealous :-) That same friend I was talking about brought his Octatrack too, also a great device. I feel it's not so self-explanatory and needs quite a bit time to get use to it, but if you are used to it, it’s a serious good device!

Ha, ha, the rules you set for yourself are very heavy ones, I would never be able to comply with any of those ;-)

Regarding “Never a module more than once (just for diversity’s sake)” yes, I fully understand that, I almost made that rule for myself too, still do that actually... just for me there are a few exceptions. I got the Xaoc Devices – Tirana II sequencer, got two of them so I am able to make an 8-step sequencer of it (instead of a 4-step) and I am even considering to get two more to make it a 16-step sequencer, but not sure yet.

For envelopes and oscillators I am willing to let go that rule too. In another post I was mentioning how happy I was with the Erica Synths Black VC EG ADSR, so I am thinking of getting another one. Same goes for the more simple ADSR of Doepfer, i.e. A-140-1.

Regarding oscillators, I can imagine it might come in handy at certain situations to have let’s say two or four the same oscillators, but I haven’t reach that stage yet. I read your comment about oscillators, I also consider the STO, perhaps Godspeed+ (Furthhhhh Generator is nicer I think but huge budget issue there...) and Dixie 2+ might be an idea...

I opened a post for exactly that matter: looking for a good oscillator in the Forum --> Modular Discussions --> Some good VCOs required, however I haven’t got any reply so far. Perhaps I put a little reminder in that post, hoping for some experts to help me there. You might want to follow that post, in case I get a reply there, to look for an additional good oscillator. If you are going to buy the STO, then please let me know how your experience is with that one, I strongly consider that one; but not 100% sure yet.

Enjoy your system, I hope you bought a bit bigger case than you displayed here? Otherwise you might need more space soon ;-)

Thank you and kind regards, Garfield.

Thread: Tension

Hi Wedoh,

Thanks a lot for your help in let me understand the NW1 :-) The Drifting through Space, is that made by you? It's a nice slow, droney one! I still don't get it how you can make it so slow?

Meanwhile I got a bit more out of the NW1, I also followed up on your suggestions, nice results indeed but that real slow output I can't get it, how you manage to do that?

I am using the Erica Synths Octasource outputs for modulating the NW1 (all CVs, currently modulating the Tune, Travel and Position). I get fantastic kind of science fiction sounds (kind of 1980's ;-) ) out of it but not that nice slow movement you can manage to get out of it.

I don't have the Mutable Instruments Clouds though, seems to be discontinued product, do you know if there is any successor module for the Clouds? Can the Clouds make it sounds so slow/droney?

Regarding the Intellijel Springray2, I got the small and the medium tank, both hidden back in my Doepfer low cost casing. The small tank can be at sometimes a bit "rough" :-) Whereby the medium tank is good in case you want to have it a slightly bit subtler. Tonight again let the NW1 run through the Springray2 and indeed that sounds good and thick if you want; lot of ways to configure (using the 6 knobs) the Springray2 from very subtle to not subtle at all :-)

My recording options are a bit limited at the moment. I try not to use my computer, I use it professionally already extensively and that's enough for me, one of the reasons I went for modular! :-) I could record it with the Erica Synths Sample Drum, wav format. Do you know if it's possible to send you a wav file via personal message within this website?

Kind regards, Garfield.

Hey Diego,

You are welcome :-) And yes, I got the same, I have to click on your rack to see indeed the Pico Mod modules properly; bit weird indeed.

Please keep us updated once you got the system and have played a while with it. Oh man, this rack with your Elektron stuff, that's just fantastic :-)

Well done and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Diego,

Looks nice! You got yourself a nice system there :-)

There is just one thing left...

Buy it and enjoy it ;-)

Have fun and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Marco,

I like to appologise to you for my earlier feedback. I can see you definitely had this better planned and looked through than I expected, so please forget my comments regarding that matter. Regarding the 3rd row for space wise you planned but didn't show it, that is a good one :-) That keeps you tight to a 2 rows planning with future possibilities to extend a few modules in your 3rd row.

Good luck with finalising your planning and I hope you enjoy your hopefully soon modular system :-)

Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Diego, Lugia and Ronin1973,

You are welcome and no problem :-)

Yes, perhaps I was a bit too negative on those Pico modules, I see you reduced them enormously now in your 2nd version. You might want to follow up on Lugia’s comment to go back to two of those Pico Mod modules; naturally up to you, at the end you need to be happy with your setup.

Lugia, thanks a lot for correcting me here :-)

Ronin1973, thanks a lot for sharing that video, nice one!

Back to you Diego, about that Befaco Output module, if you follow up Lugia’s advice to go for the Intellijel 7U case, you could leave it out. If you stick with 6U then you might want to keep it.

I got them both the Intellijel Audio I/O which indeed has no headphones, so that’s why I took as a second output module the Befaco for the headphones connection. The Befaco can be used for input audio as well as for output audio however not simultaneously. That’s why I kept the Befaco together with my Intellijel Audio I/O. With the later you can do both at the same time, getting your sound out of the modular system into your mixer but also getting input signal into your modular system.

That brings me to your point you mentioned that you want to put your desktop synth output directly into the Black Hole module input. I am not 100% sure on the exact details but modular audio is a slightly bit different on voltage levels than line audio (which is your desktop synth most likely). I forgot which one has higher levels and which one the lower voltage levels but that’s why I recommend you to use an Audio Input/Output module so you don’t need to worry about that.

Yes, it’s a pity that Intellijel’s Audio I/O doesn’t have a headphone connection. I remember I saw one or two modules who can do that, if I am not mistaken, just go here on modulargrid.net to the modules section and try to look for one that can do both (input & output audio + headphones) instead of your Befaco I mean, but up to you. I could imagine that you can solve these problems by going for that Intellijel 7U case instead; just check out the options & possibilities.

He, he, fair enough about the TipTop Audio Mantis case with 2 rows of 104 HP. Of course you always can buy an additional single row 104 HP skiff case but I think on a per HP cost calculation that’s not going to make it cheaper. I don’t know where you live however I live in Germany and I calculated for most of the cases (that interested me, the rather bigger ones I must admit) the per HP price and I came to the conclusion that the Doepfer A-100 low cost cases are the cheapest on a per HP basis; not sure if that’s for every country the same, it might not be the case. If I remember well then indeed as second TipTop Audio came with their case. You can easily check that yourself (in case that’s important to you).

Regarding that Doepfer A-138pv module you don’t have to buy straight away two of them however if in the future you need more than 4 channels then it’s just easy to add one of those A-138pv modules and you got yourself an 8 channel-mixer, that’s how I meant it but you could easily start with just one A-138pv first, that’s exactly what I am doing now too, got only one A-138p at the moment (I just planned space for a second A-138p for future usage/extension).

Since it looks like you want to stick first with two rows ;-) Perhaps you should think about if you really need three envelopes (A-140v, Black VC EG+ext. & Batumi), perhaps take one of those 3 out first, build up some experience with two of them and then consider if you need a third one? I usually wouldn’t ask you to reduce the number of envelopes but in this case if you stick with the small space you might want to be a bit more space concerned and keep some “reserved space” left for future modules, if you know what I mean?

Yes would be nice if you could let me know about those mentioned 3 modules if you like those :-) That Fusion module from Erica Synths interests me too I must admit, let me know about that one too :-)

Have fun with the system and keep us updated how it goes, kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Marco,

Interesting rack... with many fancy modules if I may say, never thought so many fit in such a small rack :-) Welcome to the club of modulars and prepare yourself for getting a huge loan with the bank ;-) Haven’t come across a bank who wants to finance my modular “needs” but that might be just me...

Just joking of course, here a few matters you might want to look into it:

  • I feel your rack is pretty small, sooner or later you will regret to start with such a small case and you have to get yourself another case, so better get started with 3 rows and at least 84 HP, if possible wider. Don’t complain about the costs because just leaving out one or two of those fancy modules should easily get you a bigger case ;-)

  • To repeat your words: “Many fancy modules” :-) That’s of course nice and fancy but you should also focus on classic and simple modules/functions like LFOs, envelopes, filters, etcetera. And yes most of those fancy modules can do that but that’s an expensive way of doing so. Maths for example can be an ADSR but I wouldn’t use a Maths for just being a simple ADSR, so get yourself some envelopes planned

  • The above regarding an ADSR is just an example, I think you need to rethink your entire concept to see if the complete system is that what you really require? My advice is to read in this forum in this racks section the replies of senior persons like ronin1973 and lugia, they replied to many cases, similar like yours and my advice is to follow up on their advice :-)

  • This shouldn’t put you off though but getting the basics right, make sure you got a clear picture what you want with modular is important because it’s just too expensive to make wrong setup mistakes and yes I read your text but I think you have to go a few steps back and think on how to archive your goals with modular, must it be modular? Etcetera

  • Another thing is that sequencer, the Hermod, that might be a good sequencer yes but is it really the sequencer you need? I am myself rather new into modular as well but almost one third of all the time I have spent into modular and synthesizers went into comparing different sequencers. I bought a few (Tirana II from Xaoc Devices for example and Hikari Analog Sequencer II to name a few) however the ideal sequencer I still haven’t found. Just don’t simply get a sequencer and assume that one will do. Try to get to a dealer and test there a few. Start with a simple sequencer like I did and then consider for yourself what’s important for you for a sequencer? I am still busy with that question and still don’t have a very clear answer to myself about that, it’s very difficult and one shouldn’t under estimate the choice of a right sequencer. Unless of course budget is no issue, then just get the Hermod and try it out :-) And then from there reshape your opinion about a sequencer to see what you need

Or wait for Endorphin.es to come up with their new sequencer Ground Control or Erica Synths with their Black Sequencer, both are not available yet but waiting for it might be worthwhile. I will wait for these two, have them tested at my dealer and then I try to make a decision which sequencer I want and then still I might not know but let’s see.

Good luck with the reading, studying modular materials, basic principles like VCO, LFOs, filters, envelopes, VCAs, etcetera. If you can read German consider this book: Synthesizer from Florian Anwander or just read yourself through the feedbacks people got here on their racks, there is really useful information coming from many people as long as you are open minded for it :-)

Then after that I wish you good luck with your planning, redoing your hopefully bit bigger case and I look forward in seeing your updated case/rack but please take your time, don’t rush it.

Kind regards,

Garfield Modular.

Hi Diego,

Nice rack you got yourself planned there :-) I did nearly the same thing as you did, though instead of Erica Synths, I took a Doepfer starter set and “uncoupled” here and there a few modules and put my own likings in it. It resulted in a set that was double sized and not many of the original modules left of the starter set :-)

By the way, I am jealous about your Octatrack. I had a good friend a week ago here who brought his Make Noise 0-coast and his Octatrack; together with my modular system we got some interesting and nice results. Very nice device that Octatrack if you take your time to learn how to use it, good stuff Elektron. I consider the Analog Four but I am not so sure, I want to see what Hydrasynth comes up with and then will take it from there most likely.

Back to your rack :-) Here a few things you might want to look into it and/or to (re-) consider it:

  • You got quite a few Pico modules planned, 3 HP width, I feel is a bit too small. I got a few Pico modules, in principle I am okay with them, they are good however once you got them patched full with cables and want to reach the knobs then it’s getting less comfortable, just too small. Similar opinion I have about modules of 2 HP width. I also got the 8 Multi module, it is just a buffered multiple so without knobs and then the width (4 HP) is just about acceptable for me but it shouldn’t get smaller. But hey, that’s just me. Anyway, I see you put some of the Picos near to each other, perhaps you should put here and there a module between them to make it more comfortable to use them.

  • I see one ADSR, the Doepfer A-140v, I got myself the A-140 (the standard one), is a good module and does what it should do: being an ADSR :-) Though in your setup I would go at least for one more envelope (if not more). I have for example the Erica Synths Black VC EG (with the expander), I love that module, you get the usual ADSR however each A, D, S and R can be controlled by a separate CV (thus 4 CVs). The extension provides you a separate output for each of the stages: A, D, S and R. I use this module pretty much and I am really happy with it. You might want to consider that as a second envelope. And/or another envelope you could consider is the Erica Synths Black HADSR EG, I also got that one and is a nice module too that includes the Hold phase and you got a switch on it to use it either as a HADSR or as AHDSR. Yet another triple-switch for loop mode: ADSR, AR or off. I can recommend that HADSR EG module too however note that this module can’t be controlled by CVs

  • Not so sure why you want to have that Black Mixer? You got already a Doepfer A-138p (I got the standard non-vintage version and I am happy with it, I can recommend it), so why do you need the Black Mixer for?

  • Talking about that A-138p mixer, are you sure that’s going to work with the Erica Synths Output Module? I use the setup Doepfer A-138p together with the A-138o output module and that works just fine, so perhaps you should reconsider that Erica Synths Module and perhaps instead use the A-138o? The A-138p can be daisy chained with another A-138p so that’s why I don’t think you need the Black Mixer, do you?

  • I notice a few double modules, nothing against it if you have plenty space but you don’t have much space left, so do you really need two Pico Modulators? And two Pico Logic?

  • In the same context I noticed that you have one Pico DSP and the Black Hole DSP v2, I would go for the Black Hole DSP v2 and leave the Pico DSP out, so you can reduce a bit on the Pico modules, I feel you got a bit too many of those Picos; but that might be just me. Or do you really need a second DSP module, i.e. that Pico DSP?

  • Similar you might wonder if you need that Pico Attenuator module, you got already that Black VCA (got it myself too, nice module, output could be at times a bit stronger but otherwise a good module) and you got already planned that Doepfer A-138p, so already two ways of reducing the signals if you like, or do you expect somewhere such a strong signal that you must have a separate attenuator for that? The Black VCA (accordingly to the manual) got an improved attenuator :-) The In Level pot-meter can be used to reduce your signal if you need that.

  • Once you got the Make Noise Maths, the Erica Synths Black Hole and the Dual VCF please let me know your experiences, these are on my wish list too :-)

  • The Erica Synths Octasource is a fantastic crazy bastard ;-) I have that module in my setup and for me it’s the craziest module (in a positive way this is meant) I have but I love it. It’s a psychopath of a module, it has 8 outputs each 45º in phase shifted (single mode) or you put it in multi mode and then any output can have any phase. I recently use this crazy LFO a lot in my setup, so you can make not so crazy modules a bit crazier by having their CVs controlled by this psycho ;-) Then I use yet another two LFOs to control the CVs (Wave, Phase and FM) of this Octasource, then it goes totally bananas! :-) If you then put the rate of that Octasource quite low, you get crazy but nice effects

  • What I am also trying to say with the above is that yes the Octasource is a good choice but you need at least one normal LFO as well :-) Preferable with multiple/simultaneous outputs so you can put that psychopath of an Octasource even more out of control...

  • Oh yes, and do yourself a favour please and get one more row planned, so 3 times 104 HP instead of now 2 times 104 HP, you will need that space rather soon than later and then you will regret if you stick now with just two rows. Don’t come with the excuse that you don’t have budget enough for that, then leave out first one of those fancy modules and put that money into that extra row

  • Sorry, one more, I am missing an Audio output module, so instead of that Erica Output, I would take the Doepfer A-138o and then an Audio output module from Intellijel (Audio I/O) for example, or Bastl Ciao or Befaco Output, something like that, to make sure you can go without worries (DC signals filtered away with such audio output module) to your external mixer or directly to your active speakers

Well that were my two cents of thoughts ;-) I am still a bit jealous about your Octatrack, together with Modular you might get yourself some interesting results!

Good luck with your planning and kind regards,

Garfield Modular.

Thread: Tension

Hi Wedoh,

Yeah... Xaoc devices, I have a few modules of them, not the Belgrad and Zadar though but will keep them in mind, especially the Belgrad. Once I listened to your music and sent you my previous message, you motivated me with your music to play around with my NW1 and though I managed to get some interesting and nice sounds out of it, not so nice/beautiful as you manage to do that with the NW1. So thanks a lot for your information, I will have another look at it and see what I can manage to get out of the NW1 :-)

I put the NW1's output through the spring reverb (Stingray2) of Intellijel, also quite nice, missing a delay module though, so I need to look into that.

Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Murodot,

If I click on your rack I get an error that it can't be found, a bit weird. So I can't see the details of all the modules, though it looks to me that you might miss a bit of the standard boring but needful modules/functions like: ADSRs, LFOs, filters, audio output interface and VCAs? To be ready for the future it might be worth it to get just a bit bigger rack so you don't have your rack full after a short while.

Good luck with the planning phase and kind regards, Garfield Modular.

Hi Skarpa,

There are thousands of modules so to give you an advice for which modules you want/need is very difficult here. Not sure if you meant for us to have a look at your 0 Coast Plus rack, which I just did. I see a combination of some very large modules and some very small modules (2hp). Do you really require 2 expert sleepers disting modules? Keep in mind when you use a lot of small modules that it might be difficult to get in a comfortable way to the knobs, i.e. difficult to access your small modules.

I understand that budget might be an issue, it always is ;-) However your rack is very small, perhaps save money on one or two of those fancy and big modules, use standard stuff first to start with and get yourself a bigger rack so you don't have issues with it as soon as you want to add a module to your existing rack? It's just an idea. Instead of those big modules I would consider to start with, for example, a Behringer Neutron or something like that, that saves you space in your rack and gives you some basic components you might require. Other than the Maths, I miss a few ADSRs and other than the Braids I miss some oscillators as well. I realised that myself just last weekend that you just can't have enough oscillators. Perhaps one or two LFOs as well? Or are you going to use your Maths and/or Disting modules for that? But if they act like LFOs or ADSRs, you are still going to miss some "boring" standard modules. I know it's a big puzzle that's difficult to solve. Getting yourself a bigger rack and wait with one or two of the bigger modules might solve a bit your big puzzle though.

Coming to the 0-coast, I just had this tested last weekend in combination with my Eurorack system and it just perfectly fits well together with the Eurorack system. It's fully compatible and I had no problems using it together with my setup. So if that was your concern, well that's no problem at all :-)

It's just such a pity that the 0-coast by its default delivery can't be transferred into the Eurorack case itself (though if you search on the Internet you will find ways of still getting that done), however other than that, it goes very well together with your Eurorack equipment and I loved the sound that comes out of a 0-coast, very nice!

Good luck with the planning phase and kind regards, Garfield Modular.

Hi All,

I am Garfield Modular, pretty new into synthesizers, since about February 2019 (listening at synthesizer's music since about early 1980's), but wow what did I got hooked up with this new fantastic hobby. Almost every day and night busy with it, since early this summer I got finally a Eurorack system, now I am getting even less sleep and even more hooked up with the modular stuff!

One big enjoyment :-)

Kind regards, Garfield.

Thread: Tension

Hi Wedoh,

Wow, that's fantastic! I want more of that :-)

How and with what did you patch that NW-1 from Waldorf?

Kind regards, Garfield Modular.

Yeah... same observation here... I just had a look at their website for details and had a look at the (pre-) review of Sonic State about the Hydrasynth. Very interesting indeed. Regarding space, if the synth is indeed as nice as it seems to be, I think I go for the desktop one (saves me space and after knowing the thing I could put it in my 19" rack, just about enough space left), indeed missing then that ribbon and the poly-aftertouch however the desktop has 24 pads that compensates it a little bit I guess ;-)

Dear All,

I had an interesting weekend with a good friend of mine, testing and playing around with my new Eurorack system and we had a lot of fun, and I learned a lot from this weekend's session. For me as a beginner that was a very good session and tons of "lessons learnt" for me.

While patching around on my system, I was quite happy with most of it, though it became quite clear that I had lack of a few VCO modules (and a few effect modules might be needed too). Thus... indeed I am looking to plan a few extra VCOs in my setup.

Important for me is that the VCO module isn't too small. I have now a Doepfer A-110-1 (standard VCO) and a Doepfer A-110-4 QZVCO, both great modules, especially the A-110-4 allows you to get some nice and funny effects, and I realise that a VCO module shouldn't get smaller than the A-110-4, while patching I realised the A-110-4 is small enough (almost too small with its 8 HP) when you have it plugged with cables and trying to reach the knobs ;-) So minimum width for a VCO module is for me 8 HP or larger. Of course, if there is a fantastic VCO with 6 HP I still might consider it but I don't want to save space here just for the sake of saving space and having troubles during patching and when using the knobs.

Preferable I like to have an analogue module but if it's digital and one doesn't have to go through menus or many button clicks then I am fine with that too. Important here for me is that it's easy accessible and self-explanatory.

I had a look in my own list I made in Excel and set the filter to VCOs, 131 VCO modules I got listed and I am not going to ask for all 131 modules if they are good or not, just one particular module I would like to have your opinion about: how is the Make Noise STO? Is that a good and useful VCO? I had already tested it, it was not too bad, but I am not sure about it. Okay a second module: how about the Erica Synths Black VCO version 2?

Budget-wise, always difficult of course, it shouldn’t get as expensive as Endorphin or ACL but everything good below that, I could consider it.

If there is anyone who like to share some experience with some of his/hers VCO modules, which ones are good (and comfortable) to use, preferable with FM, then please don't feel shy and let me know about it ;-)

Thank you very much in advance and kind regards,

Garfield Modular.

Hi Lugia,

Interesting that Hydrasynth, especially those CV/gate jacks on top, though a bit big one for the space I have left (close to zero I am afraid). Let's see once it gets released if it can convince me :-)

Kind regards, Garfield.

Hey Ronin1973,

Thanks a lot for sharing that link, interesting news. Let's hope with that move that Behringer indeed will move to more of "their own stuff" (i.e. Hiroaki Nishijima's stuff), to me that looks like a positive step forwards.

I can't wait for the K-2 to be at my dealer to have it tested there; will check tomorrow if they have already a demo unit. I am still waiting for the Pro-1 too :-)

Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Holografik,

Interesting indeed, will wait for the Pro-1 first and then consider this, thank you.

Kind regards, Garfield Modular.

Fair enough and thanks a lot for the insight information!

Regarding that B. Eurorack stuff, let's see if any of that is going to come and then let's have it tested at our dealers ;-)

Hi Lugia,

With most of your points I agree. It really looks like Behringer comes with products where either licences are no problem any longer or they are very cheap, hence perhaps the Solina SE-II (instead of SE-IV)?

As long as it comes down to "normal business" (yeah I know that's a big term saying anything or nothing) with acceptable products like the Neutron and hopefully the Pro-1, then that's fine with me. If due to the sake of taking/using technology that either has no longer patents issues or licence matters... I feel it's difficult to decide if I don't like it or if it's a matter of just the x-th version of such (older) product. So beside the matter if it's doing correctly business or not, to me if it's "just the x-th version" of something it becomes rather boring or at it's best yet another copy of something.

So my advice to Behringer is to come more with their real own stuff and not yet another copy of yet another retro product.

So how's your opinion about Behringer's Eurorack plans? I guess not too good either? ;-)

Anyway, I guess time will teach us if Behringer's approach (from a commercial point of view) is a good one, somehow I am afraid it is...

Kind regards,


Hi Squallaz,

I don't want to take away your enthusiasm here however if your budget is US$ 850 (let's say Euro 800), perhaps you shouldn't start with an Eurorack system. A "basic" Eurosystem (depending on what you want) starts in my opinion with at least several thousands of dollars/Euros. Below US$ 2000 I think it's difficult to get you something that you need. With US$ 3000 it's getting better but you still want and need more ;-) It can go as high as US$ 5000 or more and than you still want & need more, that's the "lousy" part of Eurorack, the initial start up of getting started with Eurorack is immense expensive.

Why you don't look for a (semi-modular) desktop synthesizer (like the Grandmother you mentioned) and start with that first? If you still enthusiastic about that then perhaps in the future you can consider moving to/adding a Eurorack system?

If I would be you, I would spend US$ 850 into some nice desktop stuff, and start saving money for a Eurorack system, then let's say, if you are still enthiousiastic after one or two years and then consider a larger budget.

Naturally, that's totally up to you :-)

Kind regards,

Garfield Modular.

Hi MusikM,

Is this system something you got already or are you in the planning phase and considering this?

You really got a lot of interesting modules in this one, I wish I was as daring as you are :-)

Without wanting to sound or to be negative... I miss a bit the "basic stuff". Did I overlooked it or don't I see any envelopes? You might want to consider a few of those EGs. How about VCAs? You also might want to consider a slightly bit bigger case 5 * 84 perhaps so you have some spare space since this case is already pretty full and you might not have enough space for the near future.

As you mentioned for this not too large setup, do you really need two large sequencers to start with? If the Eloquencer is the best module, why do you still need the FLXS1? ;-) I am myself still looking for a good sequencer and I still can't decide. I am waiting for the Endorphin.es Ground Control and Erica Synths Black Sequencer, hoping that one of these will be the sequencer I am looking for.

If you have hands on experience with the Eloquencer then please let me know how are your findings about it? I am quite interested in that module too.

Good luck with planning(?) of this setup and kind regards,

Garfield Modular.

Hi Ronin1973 and Lugia,

I had a chance to test the ARP Odyssey Rev. 3 (Black version but also the white version Rev. 1) at my local dealer, if that's the one you are talking about here. To be honest, after I all heard the positive news of the original ARP from last time, I wasn't overly exicited by it when I tested it. It's certainly not bad and perhaps it's just me, but it's just not my cup of tea I guess.

Sorry Lugia, I have to agree with Ronin that the Neutron is a good deal. I got that one too, here in Europe it's around Euro 300 and I am very happy with it. I thought after getting a Eurorack system I wouldn't be much interested in it any more but I am still looking at it, no better, I am still using it together with my Eurorack system and I am still very happy to use it together with my modules.

The Model D I feel it's a slightly bit too expensive, it goes here in Europe for about Euro 300 too. I am waiting for a better deal and might then get the Model D too.

Similar as you guys, I can't wait for the Pro One, hopefully it's going to be as good as the Neutron or better!

Lugia, if Behringer can make their Odyssey better than the current ARP Odyssey on the market today, then I would be happy to get that one too ;-) But let's see, hopefully Behringer doesn't follow the "touch and feel quality" of the current ARP Odyssey, then I might be not very interested.

I totally agree with you Lugia that this all takes far too long, Behringer introduces a lot of new stuff but we are waiting here and sitting ducks... that's the part I also don't like!

Let's just hope that at least for all our waiting we get surprised with one or two good products then I would be happy already :-)

Kind regards,


Lastly, Garfield, thanks for the wife's advice, although she is too cleaver, any trick I use she will know in advance.

Ha, ha, then you need to find another way to convince her ;-)

Hey Nik_Neves,

There are sooooo many filters, so difficult to give you good and correct advice here. I might be wrong but perhaps the "taste" of which filter fits to a person is perhaps the most personal part of a modular system (besides of how the system has been setup). I made a list in Excel of the "first" 1600 Eurorack modules I found (I know there are thousands more here in the modules list, so you can have a look there too) and selected filters & VCFs in my list... I got more than 150 results... My favourites (don't have most of them yet):
(this list is not trying to be complete, just a few examples, between brackets is one of the main characteristics of the filter mentiond, by no means it conclude everything the filter can really do)

Doepfer A-106-5 SE (SEM type filter)
Doepfer A-120 (low pass)
Doepfer A-124 SE (Wasp)
2hp - Comb (Comb)
ADDAC - 702 (Dual VCF)
Bastl Instruments - Cinnamon (State Variable)
Befaco - BF-22 (Sallen Key)
Bubblesound Instruments - Diod (multi mode)
Dave Smith Instruments - DSM01 (Curtis)
Endorphin.es - Squawk Dirty To Me (multi mode, not released yet)
Erica Synths - Black Dual VCF (Dual VCF)
Grp Synthesizer - 12db SVF (State Variable Filter)
Happy Nerding - HN VCF (State Variable)
Instruo - Tràigh (transistor-ladder-low pass)
Intellijel - Polaris (multi mode & phaser)
Jomox - T-Rackonizer (Filter Matrix)
Kilpatrick Audio - K6501 Philter (Multi mode)
Manhattan Analog - Steiner Synthasystem VCF (Steiner)
Patching Panda - Vibrazum (multi bandpass)
Steady State Fate (SSF) - Stereo Dipole (quad multi mode)
Synthrotek - DIRT filter (low pass)
Toppobrillo - Multi filter (multi mode)
TouellSkouarn - Kala Goañv (wah/filter/overdrive)
WMD/SSF - PoleZero VCF (low pass MOSFET)
Xaoc Devices - Belgrad (Dual multi mode)

And there are so many more, please check here on modulargrid.net the modules and then select "filter" in the function field then you will find all those I haven't mentioned ;-) For the (correct) details of the above mentioned filters please refer to the manufacturers' websites.

At the end, the best thing is to make a selection of modules you are interested in and then check if your nearby dealer has them so you can test them

Regarding envelope generators, yes I think the Doepfer A-140-2 is a good choice, I went for the A-140 but's similar. It saves you 4 HP space too compared to the Quadra of Intellijel; naturally the Quadra can do things you can't do with the A-140-2; these are two (completely) different modules. At the end it's really what do you want to do with it? Depending on that you should decide on which EGs you are going to take.

Okay try this idea: Buy something seriously expensive for your wife (be it a diamond ring or whatever she always wanted to have), make sure it's so expensive that even she will feel a bit shamed of that fantastic gift, that should give you a green card for the next few years to buy whatever you want and keep reminding her onto that if the green card turns red. ;-) You might need to fine-tune this idea here and there a little bit but I guess you get my point :-)

Good luck with convincing your wife that you need a bigger system and kind regards,


Hi Lugia,

Thanks a lot for your grand help!

Kind regards,


Dear All, Moderators and hopefully Erica Synth employees,

For the first time I have created/added "Modules" to this forum's website, i.e. the Black Blind panels of Erica Synths. 2 HP existed already so I have left that one as it is, I just updated the naming so all 7 different blind panels have the same naming convention. I used the information from Erica Synth's website.

I tried to scan a blind panel but the results were pretty disappointing so what I did, I used the same image as for the already existing 2 HP blind panel. If somebody has better matching pictures, please update these blind panels accordingly, thank you very much in advance for that!

Moderators: Can you please check if I have successfully and especially created/updated the modules accordingly to your "module creation rules"? If you feel there is any kind of improvement and/or corrections required please do let me know accordingly.

Thank you very much in advance for your feedback and kind regards,

Garfield Modular.

Hi Nik_Neves,

Amazing and very interesting how compact you can keep your system :-) Just for future purpose, it's perhaps an idea to start with a bit bigger casing, 9U instead of 6U; or wider? Sooner or later you will need the space...

The Dixie as you mentioned to use as VCO and/or LFO is fine (though there are cheaper and smaller options) however only one VCO/LFO in the entire system? Personally I would like to have at least two VCOs and one LFO but naturally it's up to you to decide.

If you don't want an ADSR I guess the Quadra as a quad AD or ASR should be sufficient. I actually would prefer to have at least one full ADSR.

You have a quad VCA and quad AD/ASR, okay but I only see a single filter and a single oscillator, are you going to be okay with that?

Have you thought about an audio output module? I can't find that here.

Good luck with the planning and kind regards,

Garfield Modular.

Hi Rickolls,

You got yourself some fantastic modules there planned (or did you bought them already?). It's just that I am missing a bit the "standard stuff". How about an extra LFO for example? How are you going to output your audio? Did you planned any audio output module (and perhaps an input too)? I see you got a mixer so that's good but I am missing an audio output module.

Since you mentioned it already yourself that you are not really have a purpose for that MIDI breakout module I would get rid of it, saves you 4 HP space. Today I just received the Erica Synths Black VC EG module, fantastic ADSR module, I love it. I bought it together with the extension module, up to you of course but I can recommend that module too. It provides you with single outputs for the ADSR (i.e. for each an output: Attack, Decay, Sustain, Release). The only stupid thing of that extension module is that's 5 HP...

So how about keeping the lower multiple but get rid of the upper multiple? For your relatively small layout perhaps one multiple should be enough? If you would get rid of one of those multiples, you get another 4 HP space free, then you could (if you want that) add that extension module and you still have 3 HP left. Erica Synths offers many different Pico modules (they are all 3 HP wide) so you can use that 3 HP space in the future for a Pico module (just as an example). If you still want a second multiple, in the Pico line there is a multiple (called Multi) available.

I would keep any way some space reserved if I would be you since you want to restrict yourself to just that 6U space. Keep another 8 or 10 HP in the lower row free for future use as well, it might come in handy. I wouldn't plan it totally full straight from the beginning that leaves you with no flexibility for the near future.

At the end all up to you of course :-) Good luck with the planning and kind regards,

Garfield Modular.

Good, now you got some spare space! If I would be you, I still would look into some classic components, otherwise extend with one more row :-)

Hi Northnan,

You got a full planned rack there :-) Not a bit too full? As you indicated already, you might want to go for a few more classic components like oscillators, LFOs, VCAs, filters, etcetera. Difficult to say though. What exactly do you want to do with this? Especially without really knowing what you want, how would someone know if you would really need Plaits & Rings? :-)

Instead of a microbrute I got a Neutron and though yes, you can use some functionality of it, while I am waiting for some more modules to arrive, I am missing some of the basic components even though that could be (partly) realised with the Neutron. So you might want to look a bit more into that as well.

Good luck with the planning and the realisation and kind regards, Garfield Modular.

Hi Quantum_Eraser,

You got yourself a nice rack planned, especially the 4ms - Spherical Wavetable Navigator and Make Noise - Morphagene modules I feel are very interesting, so once you got them, after a while please let me know your experiences with these modules, I might be tempted to get one or both of them myself :-)

Talking about the Morphagene, I know it's not the same as the Mutable Instruments - Marbles but do you really need both of them? I see some overlap there, why not trying the Morphagene on its own first, saves you some rack space and some money too? Or instead of the Marbles (perhaps in combination with the Clouds) get yourself an ACL - Sinfonion instead? I know bloody expensive but that Sinfonion might be giving you just a "bit" more at the end of the day.

I am missing at least one filter. You got yourself a lot of nice modules here but I am missing a few basic components, though most of it covered as far as I can see by the already planned modules, I would at least add one classic filter. Also a small/simple mixer might be come in handy to add.

Good luck with the planning and please let me know how it went, kind regards, Garfield Modular.

Check out/test the 2hp modules first before you buy them. I was previously also impressed by their modules however once I tested them, I am not so overly enthusiastic any more. The modules are only 2 HP (obviously) that is good when you have a lack on space in your rack (don't we all? :-) ) however because it's just 2 HP, personally I feel it becomes to congested, a few cables, somewhere a few small tiny knobs you need to turn. Try the turning of the 2hp knobs, I felt personally the "touch & feel" wasn't very good but that might be just me.

Hi Saramago,

How about Doepfer A-140 ADSR? Simple but good and inexpensive. Once you build up experience with that one you can decide for yourself what you like to have for your second, third, etc. ADSR.

There are hundreds of envelope modules so difficult to recommend you a right one, therefore I think the Doepfer A-140 is a good start or consider to check the major brands, most of them have at least one envelope.

Kind regards, Garfield Modular.

Oh I forgot, the suggestion from richc90 to take the Chord v2 instead of Chord (v1) is a good suggestion, that would save you 14 HP, valuable space if you would ask me. Unless you have some good reasons to stick with the Chord (v1), I would reconsider that module to save space.

Hi Ramirez,

Pfiew, that's a difficult question about recommending an envelope generator, there are so many. What you could consider is to start easy with one Doepfer A-140, it's effordable and I had tested it (together with quite a few other Doepfer modules) and it's a good module. I like the touch and feel of Doepfer modules, but that's of course a personal impression, Doepfer might not be everybody's cup of tea; but then again, that's applicable for every brand I guess :-)

Just start with one A-140 module, get some experience with that and if you feel you need another envelope then you still can consider another brand or just get a second A-140 module next to it.

A few more envelope generators I am keeping an eye on (but that doesn't mean other brands and types are not good or shouldn't be considered, it's just my personal opinion, so far, it might change over time too). Here some ideas and this is certainly not a complete list:

Doepfer A-135-4C, A-140, A-143-1, A-143-2
2hp - ADSR
ADDAC - 506 - VC Stochastic Function Generator
Erica Synths - Black Dual EG/LFO, HADSR EG, Black VC EG
Intellijel - Dual ADSR
Make Noise - Contour
Malekko - Quad Envelope
Pittsburgh Modular - ADSR Mk II
Qu-Bit - Countour
WMD - Multimode Envelope
Xaoc - Zadar

This is just a "small" and quick selection (my list is larger but it doesn't make sense to display that here) however there are so many more ADSR modules, you really have to look and decide for yourself what you need and want, it's close to impossible to give you here a good and correct advice; other than the option of perhaps start with a simple but good ADSR A-140 from Doepfer.

Kind regards, Garfield M.

He, he, looks like you understand this modular madness much better than I do ;-) I keep on extending my plans...
Selling your house is one thing, selling your wife and kid(s) for it, might be one or two steps too far ;-) In other words... it's sooo difficult to keep your hand on the wallet and not spending money on modules...
(by the way, I meant to write 5 * 84 and 5 * 168 HP, got struggled with the Markdown Syntax...)

Hi Noopaul,

Fair enough regarding space and budget, these two are always somehow limiting us ;-) I meant to write 2 * 84 (2x84) HP or 3 * 84 (3x84) HP but for some reason the asterisks got removed, might be the Markdown Syntax doing that.

Why not keep the 6 HP free with a 6 HP blind panel? It's always good, in my opinion, to have some spare space. Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Noopaul,

Nice pictures! But ehm... how are they related to your rack layout? My advice is to go for 284 or 384 rack case, to me this looks far too small and rather soon than later you will run out of space...

Good luck with the planning and kind regards, Garfield Modular.

Hi Ramirez,

You got yourself some nice modules planned there. Pity I can't click on your rack, you didn't allow it (there is an option to blind-out the total price if that's your concern). From what I can see, it's a compact though quite complete system. The only thing I am missing (unless overlooked) are some envelopes, or did you include them?

If this would be my own rack, I would have a look into that Chord module from Qu-bit, can't you find another module that does something similar but is less large? It takes quite some of your rare rack space. Or consider another row for some more HPs...

I don't have myself a Maths yet but I only heard good things about it, so if you still have space left (do you?), perhaps yes.

You are using Rosie for your output module I see, I had tested that module at the shop nearby my home, it's a good module, though the outputs are 3.5 mm, not sure if that's an issue for you? If you need line outputs (6.3 mm) and go to an external mixer or something like that then you might perhaps want to consider another Audio I/O module? Examples (but not limited to) are: Befaco - Output, Happy Nerding - Out, Bastl Instruments - Ciao!, Intellijel - Audio I/O or if you rather like XLR in- & outputs: ACL - Audio Interface or Vermona - TAI-4. There are many more but these are the modules I keep an eye on. I just recently got the Intellijel - Audio I/O, it's a good module however I personally feel it could have done with a stereo output knob, it's sometimes difficult to get the left & right channels exactly the same, other than that the module is good.

Good luck with the planning and kind regards, Garfield Modular.

Yeah, that's a fair point. I started planning with 584 ((2+3)84) but ended up now with 5168 HP ;-) So I recognise what you are saying here, there is never enough space, is there? :-) I admire your strength that you can stick with 284, I hope that works out for you.

If space isn't the problem (is it?), why not getting a 3*84 HP case? Gives you more flexibility and you don't need to worry that tomorrow or next week or next month you need to buy yet another case ;-)

Did you consider the Shakmat Modular - Time Wizard (8 HP)? That's a clock divider module, seems to be a handy module and you still have 2 HP left ;-)

Interesting teaser, can't wait for the album to be released, let us know when it's ready! :-)

Nice one! Thank you for sharing the modules you used for this track. Do you have perhaps the rack here on ModularGrid that you used for this track, that would be interesting to see too.

Thank you both a lot for the information provided, clear and understood.