Thread: Marketplace


Could you please advice sellers to name the location a little more detailed. Maybe in the default classified description text as a default header (like condition and shipping).

good idea, I have added that.

The good traders thread is well intended but do you really expect people to go thru all the posts to find the one guy?

You can search the thread, search input field top right.

If you are serious about that, you need a feedback form on each member profile and a way to determine if a member is a allowed to review the other. Maybe if you add a field for buyers name when the seller clicks the "sold" button?
-- lpzw_modules

I know it's not very good like it is and needs improvment. The rating can not be only done by the seller, it has to work in both directions. Maybe something like a friend system where you can see if a guy is connected to others? I know some people have a strong dislike for everything facebookish so it has to be thought out well ;)

hi bubblefunk, thanks again for taking the time to reply even when you had to do it three times.

i have already used this technique for polyphony with my moog minitaur. it ended up sounding really well, so it will not be a problem to do it again. the whole thing was about trying to fit all that stuff that i'm looking for into a 6u 104 hp, so i guess i'll have to dig some more and that's also why i was interested in modules that could do different functions even if they are pretty complicated. i see how convenient can be to have the ability to send audio and voltage from the daw, so i guess i'm also going for an expert sleepers module. i have been happily making music for years on the box and wouldn't mind doing it so, but i was looking to expand and have a box full of knobs seeking a different experience. thanks for pointing out the envelope follower, i'm also definitely looking more into those.

i just started to use the api hear on modular grid to start arranging some modules, let's see how it comes out (i'm not sure if i'll be able to mix the black panels also hahaha)

have a great weekend

What's with the extra knobs on this picture?

I just got a Mother 32 yesterday as a way to dip my foot into the Eurorack pool. I also have a Microbrute with CV in/out so I'm sure that can prove useful. So I'm going to pick up the M32 two tier rack system and a 60HP case to go with it along with a power supply.

I'm not looking to get a huge system.. just something small and compact that will compliment the M32. Maybe another oscillator (wavetable) and some effect/modulation modules (delay, verb. phaser, LFO). I know my space is limited but I'm looking for advice on what I might consider to compliment the M32 and have some fun.

My goal is to get a sequence going on the M32 and then run the audio through effects and modulators to get some interesting timbres and patterns... i guess you could say I'm looking for a small sound design configuration. I know this stuff can get expensive but let's assume $$ is no object for my little rack.

I was considering getting multiple ExpertSleepers Dister because they seem so versatile.. maybe even a few Erica Picos or some stuff from 2HP... but I'm open to any suggestions. THANKS!!!!

That info used to be posted on the website, but now that they are selling a power supply with the CV.ocd, it's gone.
There's no max rating. The CV.ocd will only draw as much power as it needs. So just make sure your power supply is rated for at least 150 mA.

On what? Get some actual Modules first, i have a 116U rack on here too.
-- BasariStudios

Thanks for the positive input. I have modules. I'm about to move from a 168hp skiff to this case. The modules I do have are:

• Moog - Mother-32 (2 but not putting in this rack)
• Intellijel - Atlantis
• Intellijel - Buffered Mult.
• TipTop Audio - Circadian Rhythm
• Mutable Instruments - Braids
• Mutable Instruments - Warps
• Mutable Instruments - Clouds (not putting in this rack)
• Make Noise - Maths
• Erica Synths - PICO DRUMS (2)
• Erica Synths - PICO MIX
• Erica Synths - PICO EG
• Erica Synths - PICO SCALE (not putting in this rack)
• Doepfer - A-151
• Synth Tech - E370 Black (pre-ordered)
• 2hp - MIX
• 4MS - RCD
• Expert Sleepers - Disting MK3
• Erogenous Tones - Mother's Little Helper (not putting in this rack)
• Studio Electronics - Quadnic (not going to keep me thinks)
• The Harvestman - English Tear (not putting in this rack)

I appreciate any real comments on this. Thanks.

Thread: Marketplace


Could you please advice sellers to name the location a little more detailed. Maybe in the default classified description text as a default header (like condition and shipping).
There is still a difference for me to buy from Paris vs. Hamburg, price & time etc.
It is cool to know in advance, maybe even saves a message.

The good traders thread is well intended but do you really expect people to go thru all the posts to find the one guy?
If you are serious about that, you need a feedback form on each member profile and a way to determine if a member is a allowed to review the other. Maybe if you add a field for buyers name when the seller clicks the "sold" button?

Thanks for this awesome website!


Where'd you read the 150mA minimum requirement? Is there a maximum?

Thread: Kb37 plans

I'm not super experienced with Modular setups, but I've played around a bit with basic hardware. A buddy recommended building a eurorack system. I wanted to start off with something simple (around 104hp(1 row) just to get a good idea of how it all works. While searching for a good case, I came across the Fartar t9 Kb37 Keyboard Controller with 107hp 65mm depth. I've decided to make that my first system and build a separate more elaborate rack later on. Can someone let me know what I may or may not be missing?

Kb37 stats

Module space: 107 HP (543mm)
Max module depth: 65mm (92 HP), 25mm (rightmost 15 HP)
Built-in regulated power supply (+12V/1.5A, -12V/1.5A)
Headphone amplifier
KB37 completeStereo line out amplifier
USB/MIDI control
Umpteen CV outputs
Duophonic mode
Clock Generator with Tap Tempo
Bus CV & Gate linkable to CV interface


On what? Get some actual Modules first, i have a 116U rack on here too.

i could see how control to readout lag could be annoying. yeah... it drives me crazy when a browser lags and you can't frame text that's always jumping up or hiding under the table when think you got it. this is handy stuff to learn for sure.

along similar lines though, it drove me crazy having to wait for either the "strings to settle" or the tuner to lock on tuning a guitar and if memory serves me right, it took 2-3 seconds for the (cheap) analogue metered tuner to settle on each note, but i got used to the play... wait for it... then adjust game. external tuners can be very cheap.


i just made a REALLY LONG reply and got logged out before i was done and it got eaten when i logged back in! i hate that!!!

i guess it's lucky for you as you won't have to read me rambling on and taking 100 tangents, so i'll just summarize...

maths & similar rampage are VERY popular, powerful & handy. they're just too complicated for ME to be able to understand as they "HIDE" their features below the surface and expect you to be able to remember the 1,001 things a single jack can do. it gave me a headache watching a rampage demo where the OP just kept plugging & unplugging stuff constantly, naming the "new functions" and for all practical purposes might as well have been speaking chinese. i'm a "one thing at a time" thinker & have to understand each thing before going to the next one. i get lost trying to understand maths. besides, i have NO INTEREST in making big complicated patches. i see a MY imaginary modular as one big synthesizer that i can swap & stack oscillators & filters with, hence the name "tone bender" while sticking to the basic MIDI/control > clock > LFO > voltage control > VCO > VCF > ADSR > effects > mixer > VCA signal chain.

in this summary, i'll use that to jump to the topic of planning and start at what was the end... don't forget the site's rack planner. i use it to TRY and organize rack rows by that basic concept from top to bottom & left to right until aesthetics get in the way and i group modules by maker or just HAVE TO put the Z3000 smart filter in the center because all of that black trim bothers me when it's asymmetrical. DON'T get me started on mismatching all black modules... i need a row dedicated to just them to be happy. besides, the rack is imaginary, so looking at it is all i can do with it.

before that, i was talking about writing things down, agreeing with you. it really helps keep track of things. i keep TWO lists, one is a module by module list of each row in the rack including basic functions with a second list that breaks everything down by FUNCTION: control, CV, MIDI, clock, osc, filter, envelope, LFO, VCA, mixer, effect etc. so i can keep track that all bases are covered as well as where functions overlap when so many modules do so many things. i tend to overlook utilities as they aren't as fun as oscillators, filters & effects, and in the case of maths, in particular, as easy to understand.

if you have a rack, you can "cheat polyphony" by just multitracking your chords. you can't do it live, but you can do it with a DAW. let's ay all you're doing is an A/C/E chord. just record one pass of all you As, another for your Cs and another for your Es. now your mono is poly and it only cost you TIME, and all of your voices are perfectly synced. me? i'd take that one step further and record each note in stereo (binaurally) playing through a speaker, then move the speaker for each new pass so when you listen on headphones, the chords get spread out like a chorus. it'd also require 3x the channels... 3 channels for the direct sounds, plus another 2 each for stereo, but hey, that's what DAWs are for, right? they ALSO make life simple letting you sequence and fine tune modulations while ALSO making them complicated making you learn how to use them... again, with HIDDEN features, like maths & rampage... ARRRRGH! they CAN be learned though.

finally, back to your sequencer & drums, don't forget that you can use your modular to process audio in so many filtered & distorted ways! i think i'd use envelope following A LOT, human beatboxing triggers & envelopes instead of letting some heartless perfect timing (analogue) sequencer do it for me. you can fit an entire warehouse full of FREEWATRE synthesizers along with an entire recording studio in your DAW sequencer as VSTs, but digital will never sound as good as analogue, especially with synths & compressors. you could do all of your polyphonic stuff with VSTs (and even some freeware ones sound pretty good!) and then fatten them up externally with filters and TUBES. that's why my "tone bender" play rack has a metsonix tube VCA... for thickening samples, digital VCOs & the morpheus digital VCF (sick filter BTW!!!) and VSTs. tubes are great for warming digital up.

well... this reply is kind of long too, but i think i did MORE babbling last time. this time though, i'm copying & saving the text because i do not want to do this a third time, like turning your rack into a chord monster.

OK... this reply is a lot shorter and one more point... just because i hate maths & rampage doesn't mean you have to. there's a reason they're both so popular, but TYPICAL modular peeps LIVE to plug shee into other shee. not me. i just want a synthesizer that can make as many different sounds as possible along with mangle audio in as many ways as possible without sounding digital. otherwise, i'd do EVERYTHING in VSTs and save $9,000+ in imaginary money. LOL

This is a great idea!!!

hi bubblefunk and thanks a lot for your answer.

there are so many possibilities available that it really is a journey, quite a nice one.

i've been considering several options since i wrote the post and i guess it really helps to write things down sometimes. by now i haven't quite think about connectivity with ableton, sequencing and modulation well enough. also, if you add polyphony is easy to see that i would need much more rack space available and that would turn my "make music anywhere" idea down. that's why i decided to start with this approach; i got me a volca kick and a volca sampler, so this will allow me to start experimenting with some drums and also use it as a sampler outside ableton. Also, i will try to use them as a clock for my system later, since i already saw some people doing it. although, i really don't know if i could use the volca sequencer to trigger the modular. i'll see with more time and calm. i guess this first approach will bring some useful insights to keep growing based on a solid idea. i also will try not to burn the cash and that's why i'm limiting myself from the start.

by the way, i could demo the oberheim ob6 and in my opinion it really sounds amazing. the poly korg you are referring too is the minilogue? i guess i could also try first with a second hand volca keys to get an idea if that's really the approach i'm looking for and then try to implement it into the modular if possible somehow.

also, thanks for your opinion on maths. it's nice to hear that you simply like more a different way to work. i'm not sure if it is a must for me, but i had the feeling that i was getting two modules on one, since it has two channels and can work as an attack decay envelope and also as an lfo. i'll do some more research on it and decide.

i also want to thank you for suggesting the new pamela. i know nothing about it, so i'll also do some research on that against batumi and quad clock.

thanks again for your input

On MG it reads "processor that analyzes the frequency once per second". That is what I am experiencing, too. It's not easy to fine tune with a 1sec delay. It might be still useful but what I am saying is, there are better alternatives if you just want a tuner.Ymmv.
Other than that, sound is ace.

Bottom row is for unused (left) and unpowered but used (right) modules.

well, it's probably be good idea to buy a larger case than you need, eg. a 2 shelf, so you have room to] expand into instead of buying more cases.

huh... it must have been a different oscillator that i'm thinking of then as i read something about an oscillator latching onto simple waves in just 1 cycle. if you're just tuning, i wouldn't consider speed as critical as accuracy.

Give me some feedback, please.

the measure & sync features are pretty handy, but you have to know your frequency to notes conversions, or at least 440Hz = A4

You can also display note values. Z3000 is a cool oscillator, but the tuner section is not very good. Too slow and not very precise, especially in the lower end.

This is the one I bought. It has the 150 mA minimum requirement. I've been using it for a couple months with no problems.

I added the L-1 tuner to my rack a couple weeks ago and can't believe I lived this long without it. Really helps that I can keep two different oscillators connected to it while I pass their signal on. I find it really useful to monitor my analog oscillators with the flip of a switch and confirm whether they are still in tune or need a little adjustment.
It's also nice that it offers different types of tuning so you can also tune external signals with it too, which is a big part of my setup.
I was using a tuner app on my phone before this, and the mic on my phone just made it really unreliable.

Hi bubblefunk, thanks for your answer! I could also put the m32 in it's case and keep the space for future modules. At the moment I just can afford the case, clouds, and an output module: Rings will be my future next module.

there's nothing wrong at all with the system as the mother 32 is pretty much a complete voice, clouds is probably "the most ambient" sounding module and you don't have much rack space to work with. if you had a larger rack, i'd say you might like rings too for "new age" pad textures but there's no room for it. huh... bummer, taking a closer look at the 32, it looks like it wasn't built for hosting outside modules as i didn't see a mixer.

now, you have a more flexible moog. besides, it's noth the tools you hav, but what you do with them. tracks have been made with less.

then how about changing the title if you can't delete it?

Thread: Reality

i'd dare say a little more than with a pure analogue

to me, intellijel's cylonix shapeshifter wavetable oscillator & rossum's z-plane morpheus filter are two of the most awesome modules for sound design and mangling audio. to me, those two modules alone with a metasonix (etc.) tube VCA to grunge the digital tones up would be sicker than a full moog 55 system, but check the demos out for yourself and see if YOU like what they do.


ring modulation is an "essential" form of distortion if you want to mangle audio every way possible. according to a review i read that praised the AJH synth ring SM ring modulator, they're not all created equal and that one, along with another name he dropped, were among the warmest sounding. it eats up a lot of space, but i'd say it's worth it if it's the highest quality, or at least in the "top 2" if the other one is even better.

bitcrushing is a unique effect. i'd toss a malgorithm in MY "tone bender" rig

if you're not planning on collection a bunch of specialty filters, intellijel's multi-mode polaris has a lot of analogue tone bending potential from juicy, to fat, to grungy.

to me... some tube grunge is essential. nothing sounds like a whizzed off all tube metasonix S-1000 wretch machine, but their tube VCA can really help thicken digital tones to add nice grunge. their slightly more expensive tube VCF variants might be even better, but i can't abide by an out of place retina burning yellow module mismatching my rack. LOL tube grunge seems underrated amongst modular fans, but as i've always been more of a sampler fan, tubes are essential for taming digititus and give synths the same kind of rocking tones they give guitars. there's a reason why tube preamps, compressors & EQs etc. are the darlings of recording studios.

i'm not sure i fully understand what it does, but from the description i read, pamela's new workout sounds like the mother of all LFO/clock modulators with its LFO "wavetables" (though as you've already seen... shapeshifter has gnarly LFO features too) and best of all programmability & memory. i dropped batumi & quad clock distributor from my play rack because it sounds like pamela covers everything they do & more, except maybe live knob & slider twiddling, but that's not my thing at all. i'd rather modulate in a DAW.

finally. i agree about rings. it adds a really distinctive sound to inputs.

as to effects, as i've always been more studiocentric in my research over the years maybe, other than maybe spring reverbs & distortion, i'd go with outboard effects as you can get A LOT of effects crammed in little multieffects boxes if you're not worried about tempo syncing (still possible with some units i think) and modulation, and there's a lot of really good VSTs too, though i wouldn't use them for analogue emulation, but convolution reverb & pitch shifting? why not?

if nothing else, i hope maybe shapeshifter & morpheus impress you as much as they did me.

at a bare minimum, you'd need expert sleepers if you want to use it for midi, and as far as i know, use that to modulate the rest of your system. so you have your trigger & oscillator (a second would be a good upgrade for thicker tones). then, for a bare bones synthesizer voice, you should have a VCF to shape your tone. if you'd like really flexible one, look for a multi-mode one like intellijel's popular polaris which would add thick, juicy, rubbery, some vocal & even grungy tones to your system. filters are almost more important than oscillators for shaping your voices, so a flexible multimode one is a good choice. if you just want to get started right away and don't care if your tone palette is limited, you might get a combination VCA/VCF like ryo's flexible apature which isn't as flexible as the polaris for filtering, but does offer some VCA distortion potential to your rack along with coveted vactrols which are good for making percussive sounds. finally you need an envelope generator. you could use maths for that and a bunch of other utilities, but a 4 stage ADSR will give you more control over your envelopes and they come in packages as small as 2hp, but a cheap doepfer 8hp would be more comfortable to use. for a small system, a polaris, aparture ADSR combo would be pretty powerful. i'd say that's a bare useable minimum mono synth setup.

it would help a lot though if you had an LFO (some would call an LFO essential), a clock modulator, a noise source, some kind of sequencer, depending on what you're doing, a buffered mult for splitting your patches to different modules, and CV modulation. an intellijel triatt would be good for that as it can double as a mixer which is handy. also, you can get modules, like maths, that do a bunch of different things, but to me, they make things more complicated and it's easier to lose functions because you can't use EVERY function a module does at the same time.

a bare bones system though is control/modulation (midi/sequencer/keyboard), an oscillator, a filter, an envelope generator & and a VCA, but you're limited to what you can do. that's a basic monophonic synthesizer aka "voice".

i did a search for favorites, and only got 4 results for that, and no results for top 5 or top 10, so i figured i'd start a topic to see what everyones favorites are, and maybe gain more insight on the differences between modules of the same type, and maybe just how people are using their favorite "utilities & modulators" if those make lists. everyone is going to have different styles & priorities. my top priority is TONE so probably more than half of my list will be oscillators & filters.

my favorite modules as a rack system
ModularGrid Rack

my top 10 favorites list:

  1. cyclonix shapeshifter - intellijel - it's a SICK wavetable synth with tons of deep options i can't even fully understand in demo videos, but it makes all kinds of crazy tones and so many things that it's funny watching it blow an expert's mind as he giggles like a little kid on christmas playing with it. it can morph between ANY wavetables (and save a "mixed tone" as a new preset) smootly creating some wild effects including sounding like scratching in one case, it has dedicated wavetables that can be used as "hi-fi LFOs", but also as wavetables and all of its wavetables can serve as LFOs too, it can do FM, it has a SEPARATE wave folder that can be used with other modules, it has a crazy vocoder that goes way beyond the tradition robot voice, has two voices and just does stuff i've never seen or heard ANY synth do

  2. morpheus - rossum electro-music - is to filters what shapeshifter is to wavetables. it can do all kinds of crazy effects you just can't do with regular filters, and unlike the 1st versions of the filter in emu synths, this one has enough processing power to modulate ALL vectors within a "tone cube". technical mumbo jumbo aside, it sounds amazing and totally unique

  3. rings - mutable instruments - bridges both oscillator & filter territory by adding "modeled resonance" (eg. materials) as i understand it for a filter that makes resonances that are actually quite pleasing & unique vs. analogue squeal

  4. ES3 mKIII - expert sleepers - must be the #4 rated module out of EVERYTHING for a reason. to me, just using it in combination with a DAW/sequencer where i have full control over both sloppy (read funky) timing of every note as well as the ability to capture mod wheel expressions or even hand draw complicated modulations that go way beyond what can be done with analogue sequencers, LFOs & clocks etc.

  5. RK2 XS-VCA - metasonix - (tube VCA/distortion) as fat tube warmth to distorted growl to sounds that solid state and especially can't. it turns any rack into a poor man's snarling (unobtanium now?) S-1000 wretch machine to tame those digital oscillators & filters or grunge whatever up. their various bright yellow tube VCFs might do the job even better, but i have issues with mismatched modules. LOL

  6. polaris - intellijel (multimode VCF) can do most of what a bunch of other filters can though maybe not as well as specialist filters eg. it might not get as juicy as an ARP or SEM, but it gets juicy enough and can also do chunky, grungy, rubbery, & vocal too. not bad from ONE filter!

  7. dual ADSR - intellijel - the CORRECT way to do an envelope generator is with sliders as far as i'm concerned (unless you're doing envelope following)

  8. pamela's NEW workout - i admit that i don't fully understant this module, but it sounds like it can do the work of both a batumi quad LFO & a quad clock distributor COMBINED with its 8 outputs & advanced digital modulation INCLUDING being programmable & storing presets! there's some things digital does better. if i'm wrong, i'd love it if someone who understands clock modulators better to explain what a different module like batumi does better, besides live knob & slider twisting maybe

  9. Z 3000 smart VCO Mk II - tiptop audio - is an analogue VCO that includes a handy frequency counter that could be used for tuning as well as duophonic sync, plus it includes a waveshaper making it pretty flexible for a VCO

  10. SEM - studio electronics - is an oberheim SEM filter clone and does some extra juicy "classy tones" without annoying resonance howling. i like that sound better than overrated moog any day. i like both the "1950s futuristic" look and smaller profile of the studio electronics SEM more, than the SEM 20 V/S/F by bubblesound instruments which is more popular, i'm guessing because people have figured out it sounds better, though i'd like to hear the 2 and other SEM clones duke it out side by side. from what i've read about the doepfer SEM, it isn't the greatest on some settings.

now... what are YOUR favorites, & why?

Hi everyone. For the last few months I've been looking into building my own modular setup and trying to do some research into what best to invest into module-wise for my sonic needs. I've had a mother 32 for about a year and a half now, and am definitely planning on keeping it, but not putting it into my modular enclosure just because the free 1/4" out is nice and it saves me rack space.

On to the rig. My primary thought is to have my modular be a device that processes audio from external sources (morphagene+external input), modulating and effecting it in a multitude of ways with various clocks, envelopes, LFOs, etc. Additionally, I'm adding a few must-have effects (reverb, echo, waveshaping, filters, Rings) to play with the sounds even more. As the system grows I'll add more VCOs, Random generators, logic, and eventually end up with this rig:

ModularGrid Rack

For right now I've planned as my first purchases to be as follows, just to keep it simple (purchased in left to right order):

ModularGrid Rack

So I'm looking for your feedback, what do you think of this initial/final setup? any modules I should consider that I haven't considered? any modules that I've listed in my final build that I should look into adding earlier? any redundancies? I tried to include as many flexible modules as I could (Maths, Peaks, 2 Distings, 2 quad VCAs, 2 mults) just so my bases are covered. The only thing I've neglected to add that feels important is a sequencer, but I figured that since my main interest is more signal processing already created sounds/music, sequencing isn't super necessary, and if truly needed, my M32's built in sequencer would cover my bases. Lastly, any recommendations power-wise? I feel like a Super PWR Blue would cover my needs for the larger rig, but I could be very wrong!

Thanks so much for your time!

ModularGrid Rack

The 1 module is the E950 circuit bent vco by synthesis technology. I plan to combine it with an 0 coast, TE OP-1, assorted Volcas & Pocket Operators. Thinking about Synthrotek Power Lunch, & getting utility stuff from 1u modules. That or the HEK (minus the 1u of course.) I know the case isn't expandable, but I like portability, and limitations.
I'm sure I will eventually get a bigger rack & add VCOs, LPFs, VCAs, LFOs, LPGs, sequencers, clock dividers, euclidian rhombusoidal function generators with buffered multiples etc etc to slew the folded waveforms and ping the vactrols. But for now, just to get that Circuit Bent VCO going, what else do I need? Output module? Expert sleepers? Maths?
Thanks, love the grids.

ugh! the graphics ar sooooo busy it makes it hard yo even see the knobs, like camouflage, but i guess if you like a colorful rack, that's your biz. even the STANDARD grey version would drive me nuts for neither matching silver or black, but that's me. otherwise, i like juicy ARPs way more than bad 70s sci-fi moogs

WOW! i actually helped someone, and i'm NOOB! i just know about it because it's in one or both top 100 lists and is in my fantasy rack. the measure & sync features are pretty handy, but you have to know your frequency to notes conversions, or at least 440Hz = A4

Can someone assist me buying a PSU for cv.ocd?

It's supposed to be:

"9-12V DC via a 2.1mm barrel plug with negative centre pin"

I've found some of these, but what confuses is me that the wattage of different PSUs fitting into this range waries quite a bit.

OR... you could get a tiptop audio smart VCO MkII and have a nice analogue VCO that can both measure & sync to frequencies?
-- bubblefunk

Ah yes, I forgot about that, thanks

Thread: Reality

Completed, the first to see what I can do with it.


ModularGrid Rack

i dropped some of the mults, the dual ring mod, the doepfer moog filter, the black VCO expander and swapped the big erica filter to make room for the smaller polivoks, move the wasp filter & mixer down to the black row, add a stero panner and swap in the AJH synth diode filter and mixer with ring mod as it's supposed to be one of "the best" sounding ring mods even if it's a space hog, but it adds mixing flexibility.

i try to use the best sounding modules. i know the bubblesound SEM 20 is more popular than the studio electronics SEM, but i didn't hear it make any better tone than the SE which takes less space up. i might drop the sample & hold to make room for the bubblesound after hearing a demo that turned me off to S&H. i THOUGHT it's how joe walsh got that twangy juice harp sound in the bridge of life's been good, but the online demo made S&H sound like an annoying variation of annoying random voltage. metallic twang? cool! non-melodic tonal babbling? not!

there's a module specific case for it that you can mount it in as an external stand alone voice i believe. it would have openings that don't block the midi. otherwise, you'll have to top mount it and hack your case.

yeah... there's the case in that video. you should be able to order it separate though you'll probably have to pay more than its worth.

OR... you could get a tiptop audio smart VCO MkII and have a nice analogue VCO that can both measure & sync to frequencies?

i'm just learning the deeper nuts & bolts of modular synthesis to supplement my decades old understanding of normalled synths. i was always more into the sound mangling potential of sampling, being an early art of noise fan, but have since come to the conclusion that a lot of the re-synthesis they did was likely samples of analogue effects. not only that, sampling just doesn't sound as thick & juicy as analogue unless you maybe run your sounds through magical VCFs & tubes.

i'm having real trouble though with the artificial limitations of analogue modules that mostly still only do the same things they've done since the 50s with the possible exceptions of clock syncing & digital wavetables (not counting MIDI as a modular thing) no matter how many patch cords you use, to me, modular analogue still sounds like modular analogue, just being driven by slightly different sequencers (which totally lack loose & sloppy FUNK BTW [and COWBELL!] as far as i'm concerned)

what seems like OBVIOUS features that at least ONE designer should put in their modules just never happen, so i'm going to share my idea of a "much needed modulator"

OK... start with the beginning of a sound... analogue SUCKS at attacks which are a major part of a sound's quality. all analogue can do, really, is change the attack rate. as far back as at least the early 90s, i remember reading an EXCELLENT idea about sample editing, in keyboard mag i think, that would have been great for synthesis... using sampled attacks... plucked, strummed, blown, bowed, iron, steel, rubber, wood, balloon, plosives etc. to add complexity to sounds. it's a great idea... why didn't anyone take it up? a great module would have a massive "wavetable" of attacks and materials eg. a woodblock being hit by metal, plastic, wood, rubber & urethane sticks & mallets. personally, i LOVE the fat thump sound of finger snapping a balloon or a basketball hitting a wood floor. besides onboard attacks, have sample memory where a user can create his own attacks, or download more.

this is a TRIGGER based module BTW

besides using SPECIFIC attacks, ADSR SUCKS!!! what if you want a downward dropping then upwards CURVED envelope for whoops & scratches or wobbles etc.? ADSR is so last century! the only way to PROPERLY animate envelopes is to be a modwheel slinging robot, or to draw them in a sequencer. why not make a module where you can use preset "wavetables" of various effects or even draw your own & i'm not talking about erica's "hey... let's draw sawtooths & other geometrics" module that's a very limited step in the right direction.

use the same idea to modulate pitch too for boings (on top of a "twang attack" would be sick), scratches & bass wobbles etc. you can do this sort of stuff hard syncing to an advanced LFO & gate combo, i guess, but then you're artificially confined to having your notes fit perfect timing (i DESPISE quantization soooooooooooooo much!!!!!!!) when you should be able to trigger your modulations per note creating new SOUNDS. i'm all about sounds. that's why i was drawn to sampling & not synthesis. the only limits you have with sampling are the sounds available and your imagination at creating new ones. on top of that, you should be able to modulate your modulations eg. do dubstep bass wobbles ON THE FLY, morph between envelope effects, eg, animate your scratches by modulating "envelope" speed, including dub style echo effects and so on. i'm surprised for that matter, no one's invented a dubstep synthesizer VST for doing a variety of pitch & wobble effects live and that the stanndard is still hand drawing with "ancient" ableton "live" (ironic name) you should be able to do the same kinds of modulations you can do on a computer with a rack module. it's OK to put digital modules in your racks now!

basically, the simplest way to describe the module i'm talking about is one that ANIMATES sounds by offering sampled attacks, COMPLEX amplitude AND (separate) pitch envelopes with the ability to add and edit sounds & curves... heck... why not let your module IMPORT curves etc. you draw in your DAW & ableton?! MIDI protocol was designed for that kind of thing. it would be a note/pitch modulator for whatever VCO you're using, then process the sound's envelope as a VCA (envelope generator)/ mixer. you could even break it up into TWO modules i guess... attack/pitch mod & amplitude mod.. even... cough cough cough*, integrate VCF modulation. i DESPISE filter sweeps personally, but you could add a 3rd dimension of "complex envelope generation" for that too... along with modulate by velocity & do the crossfade thing samplers do. LFOs would be a natural extension of the concept in "loop mode", and even there, again, you could add modulation where you LFO speeds up & slows down to the beat, but without having to be locked into it in "trigger mode"

someone could even take these ideas even further and create an entire synth voice with wavetables & samples, but really, it's just be nice to be able to modulate "boring old ADSR/LFO/portamento modular" with a little more precision and variety.

analogue needs the kind of modulation that gives sounds attacks with teeth (or wet noodles) and sounds that BOUNCE without having to patch a dozen modules that break the concept down into "micro-functions" that are hobbled to a robotic kraftwerk/techno beat.

what do you think? it's something worth creating a buzz about until someone does it? have any dream features you'd like to add like "complex switching" (whatever that would be... i'm really weak at understanding complex utilities & patches)

if anyone builds one of these... you owe me a module!

i'd be interested to hear if anyone's made a "wavetable" like CV modulator you could use to TRIGGER pitch & envelopes with & break out of "hard syncing your advanced LFO to tempo & ADSR" straightjackes and create sounds that boing, ahhhh-whoop, scratch & wobble. i'm not really into anything i hear coming out of the most complex this modulates that patches i've heard as they only operate at the bar level and not the note level.

along similar lines, i still haven't heard of anyone, even digitally as a VST, make a module for dubstep style bass wobbles. it'd be nice to be able to modulate wobbles LIVE and have them be fat analogue tones at that instead of those bright digital ones that DON'T sound like bass at all unless you have a real subwoofer that moves air like headphones don't.

as to what DOES exist, i originally had a batumi + expander & quad clock distributor in my play rack, but from what i was able to glean from the description for pamela's NEW workout, it sounds like it does everything they can and so much more with PRESET MEMORIES, but, maybe someone might prefer knobs & sliders for live performance.

while it's a wavetable oscillator/effects unit, and a pretty sick one at that too, i know you can at least generate complex wavetable LFOs out of intellijel's cylonix shapeshifter and use the LFOs as oscillators as well as use the oscillators for LFOs too.

i hope to learn some interesting stuff out of this thread and as the CV:OCD is new to me, i'm going to check it out and see if it does any kinds of modulation that sound interesting to me.

OH! OK... it's midi to CV, like the #4 rated of ALL eurorack modules expert sleepers ES3 MkII & its associated expanders. yeah... it seems like the BEST way to modulate a rack is through MIDI where you aren't squeezed to death by perfect timing straightjackets and can record, edit & save modulations at whatever the ppqn limits of your sequencer are. i'm just learning about the nuts & bolts of modular and as far as i know, hand drawing or capturing mod wheel performances are the best way to take control of a rack's modulation & break out of its LFO/ADSR/portamento box.

really, someone should make a digital module that lets you draw your CVs that you can TRIGGER along with non ADSR curves for its onboard VCA(s) along with sync to midi/clock or tap tempo (LFO mode?) and maybe have a "morph mode" where you could do dubstep wobbles or even modulate cough cough cough filters and do sweeps. why would anyone want to do THAT?!

well i don't know about FM, but as far as i know, intellijel's $500 cylonix shapeshifter is the SICKEST wavetable oscillator in the world as it goes beyond simple crosstable morphing into stuff i can't understand, but that sounds insane.

i was wowed by the variety of vocoder sounds it can do and the funky scratching effect it did morphing between two presets. i would build an entire system around JUST that rack.

mutable instruments has a lot of wavetable type modules. braids is popular and the one i liked best, not so much clouds, but only because i'm not into ambience & pads, but they have a pretty wide variety of interesting non-analogue modules you should check out for yourself. i also like rings which is kind of a "resonance modelling" VCF, but is also considered a modulator.

finally, the other wavetable oscillator i liked the sound of was synthesis technology's E340 cloud generator for its percussive type sounds & atariesque "kuzo" sounds

while NOT a wavetable synth, but ACTUAL 4 operator FM, you should check rack hogging akamie's castle out too. my eyes glazed over at the complexity of the concept, though i liked the tones, and was put at ease by another demo that essentially said "i don't know what it's doing... no-one does, just twist knobs & see what happens" LOL i can wrap my head around that.

intellijel's cylonix CYCLEBOX is also interesting, but nowhere near as much as the cylonix shapeshifter i was confusing it with. one other bonus of the shapeshifter is that it comes with an INDEPENDENT wave folder you can process other VCOs with and it has some wavetable LFOs that can also serve as oscillators and vice versus.

in trying to learn more about the nuts & bolts of modular synthesis, i've seen triangle core VCOs being a hot topic keyword and haven't been able to keyword search anything that explains WHY. i've checked youtube demos for intellijel's super popular dixie II+ out and didn't hear anything different than a standard VCO, or even digital ones doing standard sawtooth, sine or square waves so there must be something i'm missing as it seems more like marketing hype than some revolutionary way to get new & exciting tones like you can with a wavetable VCO.

what's the big deal about triangle core VCOs? i can hear a lot more variation between VCFs

well, if you want to work entirely "analogue", then you REALLY need to look into sequencers and probably clocks too to give your modules automation that you could do filter sweeps over etc. or backing while you play.

i would think it'd be A LOT better to buy a separate synth if you want to do polyphonic as it would get expensive building a system with multiple VCOs and VCFs that you can't fully match. you could get a 4 voice dave smiths instruments Mopho x4 for just $1,000 and i think with modules being even cheaper, a $500 korg polyphonic, or work your way up to more expensive prophets including the "ultimate" OB6 as from what i've read, oberheims have a much fatter sound than prophets.

not only would a separate polyphonic be cheaper, but you could get PROGRAMMABILITY you can't get from modular and potentially a sequencer and midi-CV so you can communicate directly with your modular rack. it'd take a lot of research to pick a poly that suits your tastes, needs & budget, or a separate thread asking about the pros & cons.

it wouldn't hurt for you to have an external drum machine from a cheaper one using sampled sounds up to an all analogue "808" type kit. personally, i'd be inclined to go the sampled route there as you're more likely to be straightjacketed by a step sequencer where you can play beats with looser timing on a sequencer you can record live on and turn the quantization up for looser beats where you can, for example, lag a high-hat. as with a separate polyphonic, which might have its own "high res" sequencer, you can save patterns and songs and probably tempos too on your drum machine and then sync your modular's clock to your MIDI gear.

while your pre-programmed beats and melodies are playing on your beatbox & poly, then you could do all of your modular type stuff over that with your rack, or even process audio from your other gear. i've heard some interesting effects running drum loops through a synth and distorting them in various ways.

as to headphone amps, there are modules for that you could put in your rack. you could TRY jacking into your VCA or mixer, but i think you'd need more juice to drive headphones. i'm not sure. then, there'd be the "left channel only" issue as your jacks are going to put mono out. you'd probably need some kind of stereo to mono adapter jack for that. if you were using external polys & drum machines etc., you'd likely run everything through an external mixer which would have both line outs and a headphone jack. little mixers are cheap, and some even come with effects.

as to maths... i'll leave THAT to you. it's a very powerful & popular module, but i personally hate it because it's so complicated. i'd rather break all of its functions, at least the ones i'd actually use, down into easier to understand individual modules that maybe do their specific tasks even better with additional control eg. an ADSR envelope generator offers more control than a maths could for that function. it's a more expensive rack hogging way to do things, but the route i'd prefer.

anyways, i hope MAYBE this helps you plan YOUR system and/or gives you ideas more than it takes you away from your goals 7 style.

as to interfacing with ableton, expert sleepers' ES3-Mk III MIDI to CV converter is the #4 rated of ALL eurorack modules, so i'm guessing it's not shabby, plus ES offers a bunch of different expanders as well as dedicated VST software for controlling the modules, both in a slimmed down freeware version, and a more powerful one you have to buy.

and for doing clock modulation & LFOs in your rack, little "pamela's NEW workout" looks like a really powerful PROGRAMMABLE clocking module to modulate your rack with and sync your hardware sequencer with. i had originally put a batumi 4x LFO & quad clock distributor in my play rack, but it sounds like pamela can do what both of those can with her 8 outputs and MORE with her swing tempo, advanced LFO shapes & memory, but then again, MAYBE batumi & quad clock are better for live synthesis because of their knobs & sliders. i'm actually new to all this and trying to learn what i can. i understand midi, DAW sequencers & studio gear better having read keyboard & mixmag since the 80s and am only now digging into modular, so don't take my opinions on modular as expert advice by any stretch.

hope this helps though

well, as you're looking to get MULTIPLE filters, i'm going to IGNORE your $250 limit, insist you buy one less filter, and get the CRAZIEST filter of them all x10 at $500, the z-plane digital morpheus!

do you know of ANY filter that sounds even SLIGHTLY like that? some of those tones are bite your head off and blow your speakers "digital sharp", but it can do some thicker stuff too. the point is it won't be competing with any other filter(s) you own covering the same territory.

it is a virtual synthesizer within itself. how could you exclude it over arbitrary budget restraints getting two cheaper filters that merely distort sound in slightly different flavors when the morpheus does CRAZY things, the very thing you're seeking, like EVERY analogue filter COMBINED can't do. morpheus is batshee hearing LITERAL (as in vocal resonant) voices where other filters might just get a little whizzed off.

if you just got a morpheus and the VERY VERY flexible intellijel polaris, you could cover MOST of the meat & potatoes sounds of other analogue filters including juicy, crunchy, rubbery, chunky, & fuzzy, if not as extreme as SPECIFIC filters that only excel at one or two of those things like juicy ARP & SEMs, chunky moogs or whizzed off wasps & polivoks AND the polaris is $230... well within your budget.

stretching your budget AGAIN... NOTHING sounds as whizzed off as an all tube metasonix rack. i would imagine that their tube $350-$400 VCFs are a big part of their truly unique sound. i INSIST on a metasonix tube VCA in my imaginary rack for grunging things up and fattening up digital VCOs and the digital morpheus filter. it's a slightly different take than yours, but based on flexibility in tone. i'd be inclined to get a metasonix VCF myself if only they came in silver and not that mismatching yellow.

seriously though... the morpheus filter is crazier than a bunch of other filters, metasonix vomits lava and another really out there filter YOU might like, but that isn't my particular cup of tea is the 4ms spectral multiband resonant filter at another "get IT instead of 2 x $250 filters price of $475" 4ms spectral resonant filter
especially if you want to do harmonic, polyphonic type things or get weird sounds modulating audio. it's kind of "1 trick pony" for my tastes, but it really does its own thing too. if you TRULY want unique, that's #2 on my "weird filters" list.

an all tube Metasonix Wretch S-1000 though is CRAZY... it's like a drunk polivoks figting an angry swarm of wasps underwater. it just OOZES the kind of attitude i think you're looking for and that impresses me too, true... it's expensive at around $2600 & kind of unpredictable, but yeah... it's a polivoks/wasp on acid and i bet you could capture A LOT of that tone with just an eye offending yellow VCF, which i think is their most popular module. nothing ever sounds as analogue as tubes. i'd call a tube distortion pre-amp/VCA the bare minimum for ANY rack, especially with digital oscillators and/or filters.

hey... happy to complicate the heck out of your mission! LOL

Thread: Change Log

Full Width layout

The rack browser and module browser now have a full width layout which adapts to the browser window size. I think it makes sense to better use the space on bigger screens.

Small changes to the search form

  • Advanced Search is gone. I think nobody used the standard search anyway.
  • Small improvements of the search form layout (it is now a flexbox)

I feel your pain. At least the modules with discontinued in the title are correctly tagged as discontinued.
To prevent the reverts in the future I have put a red alert label to discontinued modules in the module browser. Maybe that will help.

Here is the link for the final build goal:
ModularGrid Rack

Thread: Old Soul Mod

This is my first rack and probably trying to do too much I'm sure. My interests are ambient, slow evolving type tracks. I would like to have the ability to create some melodic lines and rhythmic possibilities. Things I currently have are the Bastl Quattro Figaro, Bastl Tromsø, Make Noise STO. I do plan to go very slowly and add a piece or two at a time and sit and learn what they can do. Thanks for any advice about what I have here.
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