Hello Lugia,

I think I have explained enough about hi-fi ;-) See my common reply and my reply to Ronin1973. Talking about the ARP 2600 though... I never had the chance to test or listen at it live but what I have heard of it, people talking about it, it must be fantastic. I had the chance, in a local shop here not far away from where I live, to test the nowadays available ARP Odyssey and to be honest with you I was a bit disappointed about the touch and feel of it. The sound was about okay but I wasn’t overly impressed. I heard on the Internet a demo of the to be released Behringer Odyssey and I must say I was pretty impressed about that sound, at least more impressed than about the ARP Odyssey. So let’s hope that the Behringer Odyssey gets closer to that sound of the ARP 2600.

You make me a bit worried about your warning about passing DC to my speakers that they will get wrecked, how bad is that? I was so far under the assumption that as long as I would put my amplifier not too loud (I stay usually away of volumes that go beyond -20 dB, with my mixer level at mid or zero and within the green LEDs level with perhaps sometimes hitting one orange LED), would that still be able to damage my speakers? :-(

If the answer is yes, what should I do then? Get monitors instead? Are they able to withhold DC signals? Wouldn’t there be the same problem?

Since I am a bit technical guy, I actually don’t understand the concern of DC signals? DC signal is, at least theoretically, nothing more than just the positive half of an AC signal :-) For which part of the loudspeakers would it be the killer? The subwoofers or the tweeters? But if one plays at a moderate level (which I usually do), I actually can’t see an issue here? Please enlighten me here, thank you!

Okay let’s avoid the word “hi-fi” for the sake of a good atmosphere within this forum, ha, ha ;-)

So please allow me to call it then... good quality audio? :-) And as in my previous common reply, “good quality” everyone can for themselves define what that is, it’s partly a personal taste rather than a pure technical specification only.

So back to “good quality audio”, with that new modular system I am planning, to start with I think I want to get started with two “synthesizers” (two synth voices?) within that new system. One for the... indeed more focussed on the “good quality audio” and the other one more for the fun tests, for squeezing out the sounds, for getting weird stuff out of it, in the search of an interesting sound, and then yes, I agree with you, the quality of the audio becomes then less important.

That’s the reason why I am interested in ACL modules and I was hoping Waldorf too, since I had the impression they might be focussing a bit more than average on good audio quality, for my, let’s call it: better quality audio output :-)

Then the other output or voice, the focus is not so much on good audio quality but rather on experimenting with sound and then I am thinking of Erica Synths and Make Noise modules; checking it out sonically :-) For me, both ways of approach have fun parts.

For the sake of my lack of experience, I will put Doepfer somewhere in between these two options, borrowing a few models for the fun bit of sound creation and a few other modules perhaps for the more audio oriented output of sound.

I hope you that it’s okay for you that I have this “split approach”, in that one way I focus a bit on the audio quality, whereby you might not agree with me ;-) and the other way I focus more on experimenting with sounds, and I think looking at all the modules I have checked so far, that my main focus will be anyway on those modules that create fun and weird sounds so for those modules, I totally agree, the “so called audio quality” is or shouldn’t be an issue there, it’s sometimes even wanted that it doesn’t sound too good ;-)

Well thank you too for all your help, and though we might have a minor difference in defining good quality audio, I hope you are still willing to support me further with possible future questions and matters I might have with this crazy nice modular synthesizer hobby! :-) Thank you!

hell yeah!! sputnik had a prototype of something like this a few years ago but never saw the light of day. such a shame, but you brought it back to life. really looking forward to hearing more about this! (don't be shy about using different color LEDs!)

Hello Ronin1973,

For a common introduction please refer to my just previous message. I would like to reply to a few matters you mentioned in specific your reply.

For the hi-fi matter please refer to my common reply. Regarding hi-fi “consumer” audio... bbrrrr, the word consumer gives me cold thrills and I guess you meant it in a sarcastic or rather negative way and I only can agree with you, so no, I didn’t mean it in that way ;-)

As you can see from my previous common reply, I have not much experience other than my just now “3 months experience”, I almost not daring to mention it since it’s just close to zero experience indeed. But haven’t we all started with zero experience and starting either when we were a baby, a toddler or a youngster or like me a rather medium-aged person?

Indeed, very well noticed, I come from that “world” leaning back lazily in a comfortable chair and listening at good music from a good quality (I will avoid hi-fi ;-) ) audio installation, but that didn’t stop me, finally since February this year, to start with synthesizers, I am glad I did, the only little regret is it should have been 10, 20 or 30 years ago but hey, we all made mistakes, and this was my mistake ;-)

When I am (overly) enthusiastic, I usually am a bit “too soon” with that kind of things, either good or not I want a modular system ;-) Look at the amount of time I have spent into studying synthesizer stuff since end of February which is, in my opinion, totally abnormal, out of this world, but I did it. So, synthesizers must do something good with me, otherwise I wouldn’t have put so much efforts in it this far and this long... I guess...

Thank you for your kind warning that this is going to be expensive, I kind of “think that I know that” but one wouldn’t really know untill it’s too late, isn’t it? ;-) Anyway, I am okay with that, synthesizers became such an extreme hobby for me that I don’t mind as long as it kind of fits within the budget. The only scary feeling I have is that that budget might get extended, and extended, and extended, etcetera... yeah... sigh... isn’t that the case with almost all nice hobbies? :-)

You mention there are no wrong decisions, well isn’t that the fantastic beauty of modular synthesizers? What every you do with it, whatever you have patched or didn’t patch, whatever setting you have done or haven’t done, it might not be perfect but it isn’t a mistake either, that is modular to me! And I love it! :-)

I hope you don’t mind that I am saying this: You mention “programmed a synthesizer”, I know a bit or two about computers and programming a computer means you are going to “programme” the computer with a programming language like for example C, Pascal, Java or even assembler however I haven’t come across this with synthesizers?

May I assume that you meant to say “configuring a synthesizer”? Since being honest, I don’t believe that any one of us here really has “programmed” a synthesizer with perhaps a few rare exceptions if you had worked for example for a synthesizer manufacturer and you had there indeed hardcoded programmed some of their modules or something like that. We rather are doing complicated configurations, making patches, etcetera, yes, that one indeed you are right, I only start doing that since I got the Roland FA-06 in early March, before that, I never had configured indeed a synthesizer...

By the way, I had the opportunity of playing for about an hour with the Nord Lead G2 synthesizer, if of all synthesizers one comes close to “programming it” then it’s the G2, it’s still configuring it but on a very high and respectable level. For this moment, indeed, I consider that synthesizer as a few levels too complicated for me since my lack of experience. On the other hand, modular synthesizers are, at least that’s how I feel it, inviting me, almost screaming at me, to discover them, to test them, to figure them out, to get them “under control” ;-) and last but not least get some fantastic sounds out of it! That’s how I feel and I just can’t stop talking about modular stuff... sorry...

Oh yes, one last thing, you mentioned, modular is an expensive format to be your entry point into making music. Yes indeed, I do realise that and I wish it was about one tenth of the actual price, then it would be all more affordable ;-) But “making music” with it, you might be surprised with my reply on that matter however to be honest with you I don’t think I will make music with that, I don’t consider myself a musician and for the moment a modular system for me is the fun combination of testing it, trying it, getting weird and fun (and sometimes perhaps beautiful) sounds out of it and trying to understand it. So rather towards testing and sound design than really making music with it; well at least for the moment.

I love huge challenges, I always did and I always welcome new huge challenges, that’s one of the reasons why modular systems intrigue me so much that I want to get one, hopefully as soon as possible :-)

Thank you again for your kind help and I hope you will continue supporting me with my future questions/matters regarding modular synthesizers, very much appreciated!

Hello Ronin1973, Lugia and all,

Thank you very much for your responses, yesterday I wrote a huge reply (larger than this one!) to you guys but due to a time-out on this website, I lost the entire reply and have to start all over again...

Because of the above reason and to avoid yet another loss of efforts, I will split my reply in three parts, first this common part and then I will reply to your specific questions in a different reply.

To your both questions about hi-fi and what I expect from a modular system there is no easy and/or short answer, though I was hoping you would ask and put me into this direction since I have to explain to you a bit more about my background, so perhaps you understand my questions better.

As a kid, I played organ for years, can’t remember exactly how long, I think about 6 years or so till the moment my dad pushed me a bit too much on that matter that I give up on playing organ. A few years before that I start discovering “synthesizer” music as I called it that in the beginning, starting with J.M. Jarre and Kitaro, later followed by many other well-known artists using synthesizers and well known for that.

Though I stopped with playing music, I started to develop a serious interest in electronic music, however only from a listening point of view, after stop playing the organ I guess I had just enough of making/playing music that it didn’t came up to me to start doing something with synthesizers.

I owned all the way some seriously terrible non-quality loudspeakers but had nothing else and listened at music either with that or with headphones (much better than my lousy loudspeakers), till I bought in 2015 my B&W 683 S2 loudspeakers and about two years later a NAD C 368 amplifier. Audio heaven opened up to me with that installation and I still enjoy that almost every day. Last year I upgraded my installation with bi-amping cabling, I didn’t expect such an improvement with a rather simple effort, it’s fantastic, and if you haven’t tried it then I strongly recommend to use bi-amping (if your amplifier and loudspeakers can support that), it’s seriously worth it, but I guess that’s not a discussion for this forum :-)

So yes Ronin1973, I am a hi-fi fan since about 4 years now and I can enjoy good music on a good quality (avoiding “hi-fi” here ;-) ) audio installation. I don’t think this forum should be misused to start a huge discussion on what’s hi-fi or what isn’t, just a short description on how I understand it (which doesn’t mean that that’s correct but that’s just how I personally see it) is: a good quality audio installation, it’s that simple for me whereby everyone can decide for themselves how to define “good quality”; it usually is related to one’s available budget and one’s taste too. The entire marketing meaning of hi-fi I also don’t like, who does? ;-)

That as an introduction to my background, so you roughly have an idea “where I come from”. Several years back my son played piano and I looked at the notes he was playing and I couldn’t read even a single note of that! I was pretty much in a heavy shock because when I was young I could read fluently without any problem music notes from paper but not any longer any more, I know where the common/middle C tone is but that’s about it. I forgot all about making & playing music since I stopped playing the organ, now far more than 30 years ago... till recently...

A good friend of mine visited me for a weekend back in February this year. He had very limited luggage with him however the small but nice device in his so little luggage that he took out from his bag was a Teenage Engineering OP-1, what a fantastic device! I played less than about one hour with it I think but wow, that was the spark and the catalyst that catapulted me (back) into the world of synthesizers and making/creating music, the push I needed to get awake and started with this fantastic synthesizer hobby! After more than 30 years, I finally got awake again :-)

That was this year back in February, by early March I bought a Roland FA-06 workstation, I know, nothing compared to a modular system, I hope you don’t kill me for the fact I bought a workstation ;-) I just wanted to get started and using a device that was able of a few tasks.

Before March had a chance to finish off and handing the “time” over to April I realised, I needed something, I wanted less working in the menus and more working with direct knobs, handling direct parameters, etcetera. So, before it was end of March I bought myself a Behringer Neutron. A kind of dream came through, no menus (yes!), for everything I needed was a button to turn at and I could patch the sound the way I wanted it to flow, fantastic!

That was by end of March, before it was April, I felt after using the Neutron so intensively that I wanted “more”! Since end of March/early April it became crystal clear to me that I wanted a modular synthesizer system.

Ever since I am checking the Internet on different brands, on the several modules each brand has, the possibilities of such modules, etcetera. I was, no sorry, I still am overly enthusiastic and can’t stop checking anything about synthesizers, the different brands, their modules etcetera. So I created a spreadsheet list with, for me at least, the most common, known and interesting brands and their modules and I am close to about a little one thousand modules I got listed and partly checked in that spreadsheet till I discovered this website!

So fantastic! Almost all the modules from I guess almost all the modular brands are represented here, in an easy overview with good search functions, wow! The rack planner, that’s just beautiful and fantastic! I love it, and I therefore have a deep respect for the person(s) who created this and keep (!) maintained this, that’s really good and thank you very much for that!

I wonder if I am the most enthusiastic member here in this forum? :-) Since that friend came to show me the OP-1, I am not lying here with the exception of 2 perhaps maximum 4 nights that I didn’t work with it, I have worked non-stop, every late evening after work and after diner when the family goes to sleep, till deep in the nights, it never was before 3 am before I went to bed and 4 am or 5 am are no exceptions and still have to work the next day at 09:30 :-( So since end of February, non-stop, literally every night I am checking out on synthesizers, the basics behind it, the different brands, the reviews, the demos listening at it, almost everything, testing for a while, on an almost weekly basis at a local shop here, the several modular synthesizers brands and many (not all though, pity :-) ) modules. It’s just fantastic. The very first time I was in that shop that I started to test on those modular thingy’s, they almost had to carry me out of that shop, I just couldn’t stop testing and trying to understand the modular system!

Does this somehow convince you that I am seriously deep into this? :-) I am now for more than one month planning and checking many modules, trying to understand them, reading the technical specifications, watching demos & reviews about it and I just can’t stop doing that, still every night I am checking and I have literally drag myself to bed to at least catch some sleep to carry me through the day times and I can’t wait till it get night and dive into the synthesizer world again :-)

In my next replies I will come to your more specific points, I have to hurry now to avoid yet another time-out and losing everything that I just wrote down now.

Oh yes just to make clear, at the moment I don’t own a modular system yet, I am currently in the planning and checking phase and just can’t wait to get one but I have to be patience first before I can go ahead with that... I just can’t wait for that (I am repeating myself out of sheer enthusiasm) and I am oh so jealous about those here who got already one ;-) Well done!

Rest me to thank you Ronin1973 and you Lugia and it goes without saying, actually all of the forum members, for your kind help, information, feedback and sharing your experiences with me and here throughout the forum discussions.

I particularly like the thread “New to modular? Maybe this can be a beacon?”, fantastic, very helpful and thus a very big thank you for that.

Bought some modules from @pibou - good contact and nice deal - thanks a lot!

Hi,

I'm not new to modular, I own and play on a techno based eurorack system.

I want to deepen myself in ambient eurorack music. So I set up a small
system which I don't want to expand in the future. I want this compact system to do it al since a
lot can be achieved with a few modules. Especially the ones from mutable instruments.

My question is about the technical aspect of the synth do I forgot any important (basic modules).
Or would this system work fine like this?

Thanks in advance for any help!!!

I think Lugia alluded to this, but I'll go into a tiny bit more detail:

When you first power on your case, there's a spike in current. Everything is snapping on all at once. Your modules might draw a certain amount of power once they are on and warming up. But the instance that you turn on the case... spike.

This is especially the case if you're using tube gear for example. Manufacturers like Erica created a line of tube modules and part of the work around was a secondary power supply to handle the additional overhead in power when turning the module(s) on.

Are you relying on Modular Grid to tabulate your amps or have you worked this out for yourself? Some modules on here have the wrong power values and some don't have any at all. So don't take what you see on MG as gospel. Do the math yourself and see how close you're pushing to the maximum. You can get the specs directly from the manufacturers.

A fuse is your last line of defense from some really nasty outcomes (including a FIRE). It's worth the time to investigate. Depending on your set-up... you just might need a larger power supply... or have a bad module or bad power supply.

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=======================================

. °ι ‪◙⃝‬

proc randnum {n} { return [expr { int(rand()*$n)} ]
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Just bought a Westlicht Performer panel from @MatrixModulator. All went well, so I have no hesitation in recommending him as a seller.

Thanks!

Colour Scheme

NOTE: Cables out of Maths CH. 4 Attenuated and Unity Outputs are for Moog Spectravox.
NOTE: Auto-Calibrate DATA then Tune M32/Disting B8 to D3, and tune Dixie II/Plaits to D2
M32 - Green
Disting mkIV - Blue
DixieII - Red
Plaits - Yellow

Maths - Orange
Peaks - Grey
A MIX/Cinnamon - Purple

Polyend Poly/ADDAC200B - Black
Poly CH. 5 Pitch Output/Anything related to Moog Spectravox - Purple Stackcable

Blofeld
A080 - Organella (no changes necessary)
A072 - Meridian (start "Speak" with no Delay then gradually increase to 24, using 1/16 length)

Overview

The modular system covers the Lead (Solo) and Bass lines for the arrangement.
The Lead Line is played by the Mother 32 and ES Disting mkIV set to algo B8 (VCO with Waveshaping)
The Bass Line is played by the DixieII and MI Plaits set to algo 1-1 (Pair of Classic Waveforms)

Gates and Pitches are sent from the Polyend SEQ both directly into the Mother 32 (for Lead voices) and into to Polyend Poly to be routed and multiplied later on.

The pitch tracking for the Lead Line is handled via MIDI directly into the M32's MIDI DIN Input, where as pitch tracking for the Bass Line is converted from MIDI to CV and sent to the second ES Disting mkIV H3 algo (Dual Quantizer) for added stability.

Both of the oscillators used in the Lead Line are filtered using the Ladder filter on the Mother 32 in Lowpass mode.
Both of the oscillators used in the Bass Line are mixed (1 source from Dixie and 2 sources from Plaits) and filtered using the Cinnamon filter in Lowpass mode.

There are envelopes for the Filter Cutoff and VCA CV for both the Lead Line and the Bass Line. The Filter & VCA Envelopes for the Lead Line are handled by MI Peaks set to Expert Mode so that there are 2 unique ADSR envelopes (Output A is for the Filter ENV; Output B is for the Amp ENV). The Filter Cutoff on the Mother 32 is manipulated by BOTH the Peaks Filter Envelope and the MIDI Velocities from the ASSIGN Out. These are sent to the internal VC MIX and the VC MIX CTRL is adjusted via the Keyboard Output on M32 and attenuated by Maths Channel 2. The Filter Envelope for the Bass Line is sent from the Unity Output of Maths Channel 1, where as the Amp Envelope for the Bass Line is sent from the Synthrotek ADSR.

MIDI Velocities were meticulously specified in the Polyend Poly for the Lead Line (as of March 31st, but might add velocities for the comping and Bass Line later on), and they are captured inside the M32 via the ASSIGN Output (set to Option#9: MIDI Velocity).

Mordax DATA is used extensively to monitor Oscillator tunings and Octave distributions.

EDITED Today, 05:44

Oh this is ridiculous, I was writing a rather large (okay huge) reply here then when I submitted it I had to login again, and everything is gone... (going backwards didn't solve the problem). I lost several hours since I put quite a bit of efforts in my reply to Ronin1973 and Lugia... hours of "work" gone :-(

I will try to get back to you another time, meanwhile, thank you very much for your kind replies!

I agree. Some serious study in VCV rack would go a long way.

But if the OP is dead-set on getting into Eurorack ASAP... I would recommend a preconfigured system if you have money burning a hole in your pocket.

Several manufacturers like Roland, Pittsburgh Modular, Make Noise, Erica Synths, Doepfer, etc. provide this.

Dealers like Perfect Circuit also offer their own in-house pre-configured systems. The median price is around $2000US. This isn't a bad entry point if you really just want to start wiggling knobs and learn-as-you-go.

Another and much cheaper alternative would be a semi-modular synth (as inexpensive as $300)... and a small skiff for external modules to be populated after you have a handle on the semi-modular.

Each solution has strengths and weaknesses and I'm not advocating any of them as being the best way to go. But they are better than your current plans.

EDITED Yesterday, 23:03

Hello Ronin1973,

Thank you very much for your answer. Yes that makes sense indeed. So one would need yet another module to get line level input into the Eurorack. It would have been too easy and too nice with just this Link module ;-)

Also, you may not want "hi-fi". For example, if you had an original ARP 2600 displaying all of its sonic capabilities, you'd wind up with damaged speakers and possibly the amp as well...because the ARP 2600 had DC coupled VCAs going right to the output. And passing DC to your speakers WILL wreck them...but you'll be getting everything the 2600 has to offer sonically!

For that matter, once you've dived headlong into electronic music, you'll wind up wondering what "fidelity" is anyway. A lot of inventive work in the various aspects of the field has come out of mistakes, errors, and general screwing around...and NOT trying to achieve some pristine-fidelity result from the instruments and/or processing. The only place you should be concerned with "hi-fi" is when dealing with your DAW's A-D and D-A conversion so that whatever results you got (be that "hi-fi", "lo-fi", "no-fi", or just plain screwed up) are being recorded and reproduced properly. Beyond that, "fidelity" means zilch in a form of music where there's not exactly anything that you're trying to be faithful in reproducing, and in many cases a result that was a pristine "fidelity" result would be utterly useless.

I'm in agreement with Ronin here...this build is all but useless. There's so much stuff missing that would be essential to a modular's operation that I can't even tell exactly where this build is going.

You need to back waaaaay up and study how synthesis works...not just modular, but in general. This build has audio sources...and then it's missing everything forward from that that should be in the audio signal path until you get to the Rainmaker and Audio I/O. The sole modulation source is the Black VC EG...but without filters, VCAs, and so on, that's pretty much useless unless you want to modulate the oscillators to make funny noises. In short, it'll be a rather expensive and unsatisfying not-really-an-instrument.

If you insist on going with modular, you need to understand how it works before doing the musical equivalent of tossing $3k into your fireplace. My suggestion would be to stop messing with MG for a while, and instead get a copy of VCV Rack (https://vcvrack.com/). It's free, it functions more or less identically to a Eurorack system, and it has a very extensive module set. Learn what does what, how, and why...and also why the UNsexy modules in a build are sometimes more important (when taken as a whole) than those really superduper ones with the blinkenlights and twistenknobs. And if you insist on spending money on a physical device, start with a patchable synth that has most of the building blocks you need built in so that you have a proper device to learn on.

This is a problem that actually crops up on here a lot, btw. Right now, you have a lot of people running around going bonkers over modular synths, thinking they're the new essential (sort of like the hysteria over the Roland TB-303 in the mid-90s)...but the fact is that unless you have some real sonic ideas and goals in mind that you know require something other than a bespoke instrument, and unless you also know the tech that makes those ideas and goals possible by having learned them either via a good text on the subject, various software tools like VCV Rack, or hardware that's already taken care of the module selection process, the end result will usually be a lot of money spent on an unworkable system.

The short answer is no. Going from Eurorack level to line level requires attenuation. That can be achieved passively.

Going from line level to Eurorack level requires additional GAIN. You cannot boost a signal's strength passively.

Yes. Lots.

There are no filters. You have only one envelope generator. There are no VCAs. There are no LFOs or utilities. How do you intend on mixing your two different wavetable modules?

The Metropolis can output quantized scales and MIDI from an external source will also be quantized, so why the big Instruo? I don't have a problem with the RainMaker, but it's basically the only thing that'd you find accessible plugging in an external sound source.

Don't take it the wrong way. But I think you've put together a rack without the knowledge of how modular synthesis works. If you were to buy all of these modules, you will spend a lot of money and not get very much use out of it. At this point, you'd be better off buying a copy of Serum and staying inside of the DAW.

Interesting thread!

For me, top-down works better than bottom-up. Here is what that means:

In a certain sense, I used my existing vanilla synths and fx as a modular system (on a different level) so far. When stacking synths, that´s similar to combining OSCs. Likewise, building processing chains like (Synth A open filter) -> (delay) -> (Synth B audio in) -> (pedals) and so on. I´d call this quarter-modular in contrast to semi-modular. Or quadrant-modular if you want to be a smart ass :D.

Next stop: Semi-modulars. Opening up the box-internal signal chains at some points, granting more access. A good point to get started and learn, as you don´t have to do everything from scratch, but can gradually grow into things. Just inserting a filter or adding that 2nd and 3rd LFO is pretty easy this way. Buying and learning on an "as needed" basis is more fun to me, as I get instant results I can use in my tracks.

And then of course, the next step is full modular, a.k.a. crack effect.

-- Icon_Detach

I like semi modulars and synth voices. I think everyone should have at least one and they don't have to be expensive. When you have some creative inspiration in modulation, not having to take the time to set up a patch for a basic sound is liberating. When you're in the heat of creativity and just want something to throw down a working bassline, arp, etc... I can get it done and then focus on the details. I like VCOs from Noise Engineering and the Braids line of modules because they can stand on their own with just a trigger and a 1V/Octave source... yet still treat them as you would any traditional module and follow them with filters and VCAs for more wiggling fun.

How do you define hi-fi? You refer to it often. Do you mean hi-fi consumer audio? Record players, amps, speakers, a collection of vinyl, etc... or hi-fidelity musical instruments? What experience do you have with creating music... especially synthesizers? Depending on where you are starting from, you'll have different challenges. My concern is that you're coming from the position of enjoying the playback of great music and now you'd like to create music. Modular is an expensive format to be your entry point into making music. While not impossible, you're stacking the odds against you if you're learning to make music at the component level. It's not a terrific analogy... but it's like buying Formula-1 race car as the vehicle you're learning to drive with.

The worst thing would you be spending a small fortune, getting frustrated and burned out, then walking away from your endeavor. Modular synths are awesome... but then again I have some bias. :) I just want you to have an enjoyable experience. Have a think about where you're at and if you're entering modular a little soon... if you're coming from hifi audio.

There are no wrong decisions and I've assumed a bit in my response. But if you've never programmed a synthesizer before, you're taking on a huge challenge.

Hi, is there anything here missing - something which doesn't fit. I'm looking for wavetable synth with powerful melody shaping possibilities, able to work with external sound sources but also generate sounds from the rack.

I experimented with an API but paused any development because of unclear legal situation with the upcoming EU copyright reform. MG does not provide data dumps. Currently it's possible for unicorn users to get a xml/json of modules and positions in their racks. I did that some time ago on user request but I am not sure if that is used by anyone so maybe that feature will also vanish eventually.

Noted, I won’t do any scraping. Any chance of a one-off data dump? I’m not in any hurry, but it’d be nice to know if this is something which you’re at all open to. I’d be happy to buy a Unicorn account for a year in exchange for the effort ;)

EDITED Yesterday, 08:19

No, there is no API and please don't scrape the webpage.
Best, Knut

I checked everything and everything was in a good way :/

A power supply fuse? I'd get inside that cab if I were you and see if there's not something shorted or misplugged on your power bus or module ribbons. That's more likely, given that you got the synth turned on and used it before the fuse popped.

Right...ratcheting is a rapid repetition of a single stage's voltage settings, generally at some fraction of the main clock pulse. Although, I will point out that while that Koma Komplex is a rather spendy device, it has a lot of possible control routings that can give you this result along with many others...particularly if you have a Boolean logic module (or two) in your build. Also, modules such as comparators can be used to output controlling gates in conjunction with using a sequencer row for timing CVs. Given enough logic, clock counters, dividers and multipliers, extra gate/trig sequencers and comparators, you can make even a fairly simple sequencer turn backflips.

Hi Lugia, Mosorensen, All,

Thanks a lot for your feedback and information, very useful, I am already hours busy "processing" your provided information and provided links, very helpful!

Regarding the Doepfer A-160-5, I saw this module as well as the A-160-2, these modules are certainly interesting however I don't think it can do what I want however I might need one of these modules for other purposes later on.

The links to muffwiggler are very useful, provides a lot of information and it... he, he... it gives me a good feeling that I realise that I am not the only one here on this planet that's struggling to find a sequencer that suits one well, looks like it's a big & difficult job to find the "perfect" match regarding a sequencer.

The doudoroff.com/sequencers/ link is fantastic, thank you! It gave me some ideas of sequencers I didn't know about yet, on the other hand it confirmed a little bit of what I was afraid... there aren't many sequencers that have this repeat option, especially in combination with availability and reasonable price.

The Koma Elektronik - Komplex Sequencer is certainly a nice one, but it's not modular and the price is "nice" too...

Two modules might be interesting but I guess they aren't released yet and thus we have to wait for them to become available to see if it would fit ones "specifications" and that are: Erica Synths Black Sequencer and Endorphin.es Ground Control, both sounds interesting and I can't wait for them to become available!

Oh yes, just for my understanding (and please correct me if I am wrong), repeat is rather repeating the same tone at the number of times it has been set to and in the same tempo of the entire sequence, where ratcheting is rather very fast (as fast as possible?) repeat the same tone to the number of times set and not necessarily in the same tempo as the sequence itself. Right?

To summarise: A sequencer with direct knobs/sliders without menu stuff (or just a simple menu might be still okay), with repeat option and a reasonable price seems not to exist, if one put on top of that yet another requirement: "Chainable" (and even forgetting the price) then to me it looks like that I might need to look on another planet for such devices, perhaps a hole in the market for some manufacturers lurking here around on the forums? ;-)

Thanks Lugia,
Yesterday night after played for an hour,
i had a fuse who was burned ... That's why I asked it :/
I don't really know whats happened.

Anyway, thanks you :)

No, that's fine. While you should always have extra current capacity in a power supply (mainly due to inrush current values on power-up), your total module draws are pretty much within the "safe" figures to avoid an overload.

Awesome thank you so much! I get it now....the signal from the Loquilic goes into channel 1 of the mixer....then the mult is being used to feed that signal into the 12db and 6db of the LXD....and the Zularic hits the LXD / the LXD is the gate.

The Zularic Repetitor is a trigger sequencer. It takes a clock signal and output different patterns of beats.
The Loquilic is an oscillator, just makes a fixed tone, so to get it to make pulses of sound it's plugged into the LXD through that mixer. The signal is being multed to the 2x channels of LxD so that two different drum sounds can be made from the same oscillator.
The LXD is a low pass gate acting on the oscillator, the top and bottom channels sound a little different, and it's being struck by the gates from the Zularic, this makes like a little drum sound each time the gate excites the LXD.

Howdy everybody!

I have been watching this minimal rack video on Youtube and am just fascinated by all the pattern variation this guy is getting! Hoping someone can please help me out and explain the overall signal flow, in particular how the Make Noise LxD and the multiples on that mixer is interacting with everything else. Note quite sure why the guy patches from the multiple to the 12db and and 6db on the LxD? I get how the pulse is feeding the beat on the Zularic Repetitor, and how the Loquelic Iteritas is modulating the signal....then I get kind of confused. Also, if anyone has any suggestions on an alternative way to achieve the same result, I am open ears as I would really like to build something around this idea. Many thanks!

Here is the link for the video by the way:

Good afternoon!

Interesting setup you have going on here; has given me some things to think about as I am planning my build. One thing I have noticed is you do not have much in terms of a clock source. Have you thought about adding something from 4ms, Pams workout, or a Make Noise Wogglebug? Perhaps Make Noise Tempi? Clock dividers are fun! :)

Also as I recall the Midi module you have there is discontinued. If you have a source for one that's cool (Im sure you can find one secondhand somewhere), otherwise if I were you, perhaps consider Mutant Brain, uMidi from Intellijel, Doepher A-190-3, or maybe Pittsburgh Midi 3. Thinking about it more, you can probably pull off having your Midi module also be your clock generator too, in which case you may not need something like a Wogglebug or Tempi while starting out (on the fence about that idea).

I might also be missing something here, how are you planning to mix down to to your headphone module? The VCA right to the Make Noise? A mixer module of some kind may be handy, such as Doepher A-138s Mini Stereo mixer. Another VCA could also give you some more to work with.

Noticed you also have quite a few modules from Mannequins. Have you ever taken a look at their little looper module W/ ?

Looking at this setup overall, I would also be on the fence on having the dual ADSR. As your main voice Atlantis already has an ADSR, you could consider dropping the additional ADSR which opens up some space for a filter, LFO, more VCA, or a mixer etc etc. It is very possible I am overlooking a must have aspect of your workflow where the additional ADSR makes sense. :)

Final thought: You can also consider getting a clone Plaits. There are a few makers out there that have a 6hp Plaits clone. You could then squeeze in the W/ if that strikes your fancy, or maybe some modules from 2hp or some Erica Pico modules?

EDITED Sunday May 19, 20:13

Couldn't make it this time so I'm interested what you guys have seen. Do tell!

Greetings,

I’d like to do some silly neural net experimentation with eurorack module data, inspired by Janelle Shane’s https://aiweirdness.com — i.e. train a neural net at least on module names, maybe on names and descriptions, then let it come up with new ones and see if they’re any weirder than existing modules.

Is there some sort of internal API which would let me easily get lists of module names, manufacturers and descriptions in one go? I found https://www.modulargrid.net/e/modules/find/page:2 which would be easy to scrape, but there are no descriptions. A data dump of the whole module DB table as a CSV file would also be fine, if an admin would be willing to go to the effort of exporting one and sending it to me.

Many thanks,
Barnaby

Hey guys,
I'm trying to build a rack for BOC-ish and other ambient noises.
https://cdn.modulargrid.net/img/screenshots/rack706096.jpg?ts=1558268094
I've tried to design this to be as versatile as possible, so that it won't feel too limited. I'm a total noob, so I have no practical experience, but I've tried to think of all the utilities one might need. currently I have a digitakt that will be used as main sequencer, as well as providing drums and samples, however, I've found the melodic sequencing to be a little tedious and uninspiring. is a eurorack sequencer something i should invest in? another problem is i don't have any way to mix the digitakt and modular together without a computer, and that's what I'm trying to get away from. i'd love to hear your opinions, as I don't have to many people that talk to me about this stuff.

EDITED Sunday May 19, 12:15

It's a pleasure. I think the key thing to take away from it all is that ACL know what they're doing and the quality is top notch.

"Sequencers" is a big topic. There are many types of sequencers and very different uses and strong opinions (Metropolis and Tirana II are pretty much at opposite ends of the spectrum). This has been debated extensively at Muffwiggler, and I can recommend reading through the threads over there.

A quick search gave the following places to start (but there are many others):

http://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=216839

http://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=161153

http://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=180779

There is also an extensive comparison of sequencers here:

http://doudoroff.com/sequencers/

EDITED Sunday May 19, 06:04

The thing you're looking for here isn't a sequencer...it's a clock multiplier, and the function you're talking about is "ratcheting". Have a look at Doepfer's A-160-5. That module can output multiple clock pulses based on an incoming clock, and the amount of repetitions can be voltage-controlled. Now, as to how to get it to work...that's going to vary from sequencer to sequencer that you use it with. By and large, though, you're looking at clock modulation and logic functions when you're talking about something of this sort. In some cases, you might be able to trigger the ratcheting from a stage pulse. Others might require something a bit more elaborate with some logic gating. It all more or less depends on which sequencer seems like a good fit for you...and once you sort that out, then the next step will be figuring out how clocking should work for you and all of the related fun with that.

I am looking for a sequencer with a repeat option, the obvious one is the Metropolis from Intellijel that has a repeat option (i.e. at one step it can repeats itself up till 8 times, configurable from 1 till 8 times). I am actually really impressed by what the Metropolis can (or what I believe it can since the lack on experience here from my side ;-) ).

However... it's 34 units wide and it's price causes me quite some tears in my eyes when I am honest. So my question is, are there any other sequencers that have this "repeat" option (without the need of going deep in a menu's structure)?

The only other module I found so far that comes close to it or at least hast a repeat function as well is the Xaoc Devices Tirana II module that can repeats one step up till 4 times and one module is a 4 steps sequencer (it's chainable!). I haven't found a slide function though (the Metropolis has).

Does anyone know any other sequencer that has this "repeat" functionallity? Or anyone that was perhaps in the luxurious position two had both, the Metropolis and the Tirana modules and can give here perhaps some experience values of these modules?

The strong point for Tirana II for me is, it's chainable (as far as I am aware the Metropolis isn't or is it?), so if you have unendless money and you take one row as a maximum for a sequencer then with a 168 width row, one could theoretically go up till: 168 TE / 6 TE = 28 modules * 4 steps = 112 steps sequencer ;-) I am joking of course, that's not really realistic because 28 modules would be about Euro 5320 and for that money most of us would buy other things ;-) But 8 or 16 steps might be realistic. At least for the money of one Metropolis one can buy at least 3 Tiranas II and have thus a 12 step sequencer (instead of the 8 step Metropolis).

The Metropolis on the other hand has more options, more settings can be changed and even saved and loaded, that's all not possible with the Tirana II, therefore my question: is there any other sequencer that's affordable and has this repeat option?

As always, your opinion, feedback and experiences is very much appreciated, thank you!

Thank you cosmic94, I will keep an eye on that Discrete Core Ladder module.

Hi there,
I’m new in this world and I would like to know if something wrong with this :
I bought an doepfer p9 psu3 case
Wich is
+2000ma +12v
+1200ma -12v
4000 ma +5v

Currently,
My configuration is
1520 mA +12V
| 838 mA -12V
| 0 mA 5V

Does it feet or am I wrong ?
For me, I can understand this :
My configuration consume :
1520/2000 +12v
838/1200 -12v
0/4000 +5

Thanks for your help

Depth in search results

If you sort by depth the actual module depth is displayed in the module boxes beside the HP info.
Modules without an assigned depth will be excluded from the result.
-- modulargrid

Woo-hoo!!! A very welcome change, especially with all of the 40mm-and-less-type cabs hitting the market these days.

A quick chime about the ACL Discrete Core Ladder and Stefan's support in general:

The module is a lovely sounding filter - my favourite in fact! It's very well thought out with a 3 channel mixer, 2 frequency cv inputs, resonance cv, outputs for 6, 12, 18 and 24 db/oct slopes, bass boost and a two feedback circuits to get either the classic ladder taper as the frequency drops or another that allows you to get the resonance pretty low. The filter takes to overdriving and fm very well. Slamming the inputs at high resonance settings sounds absolutely killer. I picked up the AJH at the same time and ended up sending it back as the ACL ladder could do everything the AJH could and then some.

Speaking with Stefan has been a pleasure too; he's a super cool guy to talk with.

Attention to detail and sonic quality is the name of the game for them and it really shines through playing with the filter. On the whole my experience with ACL has been very positive and I can't recommend trying their modules out enough.

Thank you all very much for your hints & ideas here. For a newbee like me very useful and very interesting. I hope I can be at some point at some help for someone as well. At the moment, I am afraid I am full with questions (see other threads) ;-) So thank you very much for your kind patience too!

The Erica Synths Link module seems to be a simple yet very interesting module to me. Looking at the information on Erica Synths' website, this is a passive module that has 5 inputs (3.5 mm jackets) and attenuates these Eurorack signals into line level signals at 6.3 mm jackets outputs. So far so good and really useful as I believe and already shortly mentioned in another thread.

Though I wonder, since it's a passive module, would it be possible to use this module the other way around as well? Meaning if one would have an incoming line level signal on one of those five 6.3 mm jackets, could you then get it converted to output as a Eurorack signal? Or would this module only work one way, i.e. the way I described at the top of this message? Anyone knows from experience working with this module?

Thank you very much in advance!

Depth in search results

If you sort by depth the actual module depth is displayed in the module boxes beside the HP info.
Modules without an assigned depth will be excluded from the result.
-- modulargrid

EDITED Saturday May 18, 01:32

Thank you Ronin for your feedback. Since I am new to modular synths I was under the impression that at least ACL focusses on a good audio quality level. Before I got interested recently in synthesizers, I kept myself pretty busy with HiFi stuff and to be honest, it is difficult to judge which module might be an interesting one for a good HiFi circuit and which aren't. I just heard that ACL seems to be pretty good if it comes to hifi audio. So that rumour I heard is that correct?

I tested at a local shop the Waldorf Quantum, I was pretty impressed by it and before you shoot me here straight away, please allow me to explain ;-) At that time it wasn't clear yet to me what I wanted, now it's clear to me I want a modular synthesizer system (containing, at a certain stage at least, several synths within that system). Since I discovered that Waldorf has modules for the modular system as well, I was kind of interested and wonder if Waldorf modules can be mixed up with ACL modules to form one or another way one kind of synthesizer within my to be future modular system. Mind that I mean with if Waldorf & ACL can be mixed I mean that from a hifi point of view, are they about equal level if we talk about quality (hifi) audio level. I heard again a rumour that Waldorf might not be up to the level of ACL. Naturally you are welcome to mention other brands that have & concern about high quality audio; naturally the con of that is the usual high prices of the modules. So yet another planned synthesizer within my future modular system would be less focussing on high quality audio more though on functionality and possibilities of the modules themselves.

So to decide for myself (you are right of course, one needs to made up his/her mind: what do you really want with your modular system) which modules from Waldorf & ACL I am interested in, well that's difficult to decide if there is barely nothing to look for and other than the manufacturer's information about it, there isn't much additional information on these both brands' modules. For Waldorf I couldn't find really much on the Internet (youtube for example), for ACL modules a bit more but still not too much to give me a good impression and enough details to decide into which modules I would be interested or not.

I therefore was hoping people could share here their experiences with any of the Waldorf modules except the CMP1 that one doesn't interest me much (there are only 5 if I am not mistaken, so minus the CMP1, the other 4 I am interested in) and though ACL has a few more, not that huge number either. Also just general impressions, pros/cons of both brands modules would interest me, just to give me an impression. Anything at the moment is more than I know now about both brands ;-)

For many other brands, I had already a chance to test several modules (per brand I am interested in) at a local shop nearby I live however Waldorf was not available for testing and for ACL only a few modules that didn't interest me much so far. Okay from ACL currently the two modules that interest me most would be QLFO and the VC Dual Delay, however if there are users who have great (or less great) experiences with other ACL modules such information would be still much appreciated.

Thank you very much in advance for sharing your experiences.

Thank you!

Looks a bit better now