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What Type of utility modules?
-- darksoul

if you are referring to my signature - effectively all of them - mixers of all sorts, vcas (especially cascading ones), switches, attenuverters etc etc - use for modulation and triggers as well as audio - doepfer almost always has a reasonably priced version of everything (but it looks like you know that already)

-- JimHowell1970

Can you give some ideias, the first ones o should buy first?

EDITED Aug 7th 2021, 18:48

You already have one of the best trigger sequencers on the market (Metron). I would really recommend keeping that and adding the Metropolix or something similar to it. That would be a very powerful combination.

The more I research about the Metropolix, the more GAS I fall prey to. I'm growing convinced it's exactly what I'm looking for.

This leads to a central question: Do I keep the Metron? If not, should I transfer to an external drum machine? How do I sequence drum modules without Metron, maybe Grids? Do I keep the Metron but mostly not use it in preference over other rhythm generating sequencers? Could I somehow augment the Metron with other trigger generators?

Can I just say how fun this all is? I absolutely love a good optimization problem.

What Type of utility modules?
-- darksoul

if you are referring to my signature - effectively all of them - mixers of all sorts, vcas (especially cascading ones), switches, attenuverters etc etc - use for modulation and triggers as well as audio - doepfer almost always has a reasonably priced version of everything (but it looks like you know that already)

Thanks :) This was certainly a fun patch.... fairly sure the Moon Phase filter from Patching Panda might be my next DIY build to compliment the Chainsaw & ST Modular SVCA (though the latter is a weird VCA, quirky is probably the best description).

Wow. This is beautiful. Gives me Yamaha CS80/Blade Runner vibes.
I'm now regretting selling my Chainsaw. Unfortunately, I never got around to using it as creatively as you. You're inspiring me to consider trying it out again.
Keep sharing!

Just a mellow filtered thing....

There might be a couple of mins of Silence at the start of this as the audio capture didn't start in OBS.
Second patch with Acidrain Chainsaw, heading through HNVCF and Omsonic FLF on separate channels going into Monsoon Clouds and I've got the Rebach VCF-AB being fed some noise and self resonating with the Befaco Burst plucking and envelope ratchet triggers.
I literally just found the most simple fun too, Noise out of the Disting, into a VCA then into a Channel of the ADDAC103 and ride the 103 as a filter with the VCA for all manner of lovely blippy sweepy grunge from a simple noise source :) then thru the Pico DSP.

EDITED Aug 7th 2021, 15:31

Looking at the Metron, it does make sense that you'd have some trouble since it's primarily a trigger sequencer. Thinking through the original question a bit, the Intellijel Scales can function as a dual quantizer and also as a sequencer I think, worth checking out along with the Metropolix.

EDITED Aug 7th 2021, 14:46

What Type of utility modules?

I have all already with MDLR PORTABLE 12U/104HP box, I need some bases to start.
Music Techno more melodic ambient.
Have some voltas micro freak, some delay and reverb pedals. This type of gear, nothing modular.
Have already made some music with the módulos i have.

what sort of tips?

which of these modules do you own?

what sort of music are you making?

what other gear do you own?

Hello , im new in the world of modular.

This is my set up, its possible some tips.
Thanks

EDITED Aug 7th 2021, 12:15

Thank you @GarfieldModular. I know techno isn't your favorite style of music, so I appreciate your time and feedback. :)
I use the term "jazz" very loosely in the sense that this is music fully created in the moment. Haha.
Have a great weekend.

Sounds interesting and looks like fun to me :) As I understand you finished planning and did not buy everything yet so here are some thoughts:

• I recently got the Harmonic Oscillator and although it takes up quite a lot of space in your system I think it’s absolutely worth it
• Did you consider having a Tete and Tetrapad Combination instead of a second Pressure Points? I don’t have Pressure Points but Tete and Tetrapad would offer a great number of additional functions
• The Mimeophon is definitely a good choice (clocked, freeze function, filter…) The reverb is also ok but I would think about adding a separate one with more controls. I really like the Tiptop Zverb - sounds huge and has only 8hp
• An alternative to a separate reverb could be MI Beads for granular textures. Would be interesting under the plucky shamisen
• Rings also is a nice idea. I don‘t use it that often any more to be honest but together with the Shamisen and manipulation via Pressure Points (or Tete Tetrapad) I can imagine it to be a good way of bringing additional character to the sound
• I don‘t know the Periformer but it has almost the size of the Five 12 Vector Sequencer which is really amazing. Maybe overkill for the system at the moment but they have the tendency to grow fast ;)
• Did you think about a 1u row in your case? You could put a small mixer or maybe the Intellijel Multi FX in there. I like the Intellijel 1u 104hp performance cases because because you already have the Power supply in it and there are in- and outputs integrated on the backside which you can connect with their 1u Input/Output modules (do you already have a power source / external mixer with headphone outputs?)
• Pam’s New Workout also is a also good choice - so much function on small space and easily accessible clock division - I doubt that having it you need the additional 2hp Div

Just some inputs…. In the end it highly depends on your taste and the way you like to interact with different types of control and this is just one approach of many. I think one of the most important things to know in the beginning is that if you ask four modular doctors you get five different diagnoses ;)

Edit: checked out the public rack and saw that you added a filter…. missed to mention that - definetly makes sense

Cheers and have a nice weekend

EDITED Aug 7th 2021, 11:11

make your rack public and cut and paste the link - helps us help you!

Hey guys,

I almost finished my case for eurorack experimentation both with an external acoustic japanese instrument (Shamisen) and with the eurorack itself.
I was wondering what you, people expert in this world I’m entering in, think about this rack and what it’s missing for its last 18HP of space.
The filling plate is for a preamp for the shamisen a friend of mine (inventor at Unwndevices) made.

Thanks

https://cdn.modulargrid.net/img/racks/modulargrid_1539626.jpg

This should work: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/mutable-instruments-stages In this case, you can assign the time/level jacks as needed, and even break out the EG segments so that you can also use this as a sequencer. Not your basic ADSR, and it IS a tad spendy, but if you want that level of control, it doesn't get much better than this...even at $359.

Hi Farkas,

Brilliant! In that sense that I admire your courage to just get started, recording and yes, really getting started, getting into it :-) That's nice to hear and to see in the video. The jazz I am missing a slightly bit here in this jam, other than that great work!

Thanks a lot for sharing this, have a good weekend and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Nickgreenberg,

Sorry about my rushed-off reply from yesterday night, I was about to go to bed but I wanted to give you a first reply. Thanks again for your feedback as well as for your kind remarks, much appreciated :-)

Regarding your first point about shortening the report, indeed that seems to be the good way forward, similar feedback received already and together with Plragde looking into this. I think I follow up here on the advice from Plragde to split the document; I still need to work out that idea a bit more and I might need to update my website for that a bit but I think I will go that road yes. Still the contents of it I will leave for the moment about the same, naturally feedbacks that I receive and those that I consider worthwhile to implement, I will do so accordingly.

Then about the speed... hmm yes, what I did is, I made a very extensive template for my review reports. So the large "text" work has already been done, so that part is mostly copy/paste however for every module I have to check the about 200+ parameters that might be different for each module. Then the functionality (chapter 5) is different for each module or might be different and that needs to be fine tuned to the functionality of the module that I am reviewing. Similar for chapters 4 and 6 and of course the summarise chapter 2.

About your second point, I explained that already yesterday to you. Yes, if I would have more time I could do a video as well. On the other hand, as already explained, I do think there are already enough videos available on Youtube ;-) But perhaps in the far future I might change my mind about this matter. Let's see.

Your third point, has some overlap with the speed matter from your first point; so for that please refer to my reply to your above first point. About more interesting modules, ha, ha, yes I certainly understand your point here, as also already explained yesterday, over time I will build up my experience (I hope at least I will) and then slowly and step by step I will look into the more interesting and complicated modules, however that will take its time.

Yes, that list of Doudoroff's sequencers is great, isn't it? Very good point :-) That's in the future "already covered" in my review reports in paragraph 5.5 - Comparing this module with other modules; currently marked as a placeholder only. Once I have more time, I am going to look into that and come up with a template for that paragraph as well as I need to have enough modules with one and the same functionality to be able to compare them with each other. This is something I definitely want to work on, not sure how soon but that's one of my priorities! Thanks a lot for pointing this out :-)

He, he, 15 minutes to check out a module? :-) Isn't that a bit (too) short? :-) Not that I want you to force into anything else other than what you prefer to do of course. For a simple module like a Doepfer A-140 ADSR or Doepfer A-145 LFO I might indeed also look only an hour or so into it, however for me at least, the other extreme is the Vector (Five12) sequencer over more than a year-and-a-half time span I think I spend certainly a month perhaps even two months (in total and let's say a few hours per day) time to investigate sequencers, checked that Doudoroff's list and checked almost all interesting sequencers. For me choosing a good sequencer was so far the most intensive research and most difficult decision. Luckily the Vector plus expander doesn't let me down, it's a great sequencer by the way.

Don't get me wrong here, point taken from you, this is very valuable information for me to understand the reader better. So lesson learnt for me: I need to focus on keeping the review report as compact as possible, so a quicker check for the reader is easier and better possible. In that sense, thanks a lot for your input :-)

The "what's in it for me" I answered already, to summarise that, this is for me a fantastic hobby and for a fantastic hobby I don't mind to spend tons of time :-)

Thank you very much, I hope with my style of answering I don't frighting you off and I hope you keep coming with your feedback in the future if you notice anything that's worth letting me know. Till then, I wish you a good weekend, enjoy modular and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Ronin1973,

Thanks a lot for your reply. As already mentioned in my previous post to you, I added the "Reverse power protection" parameter, you might have missed it :-)

Those voltage ranges for each output and/or input, is actually a good one. The part that disturbs me a bit here is that for this kind of information most manufacturers even don't bother to provide such information neither on their websites nor in their manuals. Yes, I know there are a few manufacturers who provide this information, then again not consequently over all their modules...

That makes it even more difficult for me to provide a consequent stream of "equal information" (as that's what it seems to me you are looking for, and I actually do look for that too) regarding that matter. I added the reverse power protection parameter since I do think that's indeed good to have that information quickly available, you got a good point there and thank you very much for that.

Regarding the voltage ranges for the jacks, yes it's a very valid and good point too however for the moment I do see a practical issue about that (since the manufacturers barely provide this information, i.e. as explained above) that I am not going to include that as part of the parameters in chapter 3 however the little good news for you is, for those modules where this information is provided, I usually add that in the flow diagram in paragraph 5.4. So what you could do for the time being till the manufacturers will provide more regularly this information, is to check out paragraph 5.4, if a module has been provided with this information then you can find it in the flow diagram.

Thanks a lot for your feedback, have a good weekend and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Gumbo23,

Ha, ha, this is cool, dub music done by a modular system! Bravo! :-)

Thanks a lot for sharing this and kind regards, Garfield.

Thanks @wishbonebrewery. I don’t live too far from Detroit so I probably absorbed the whole minimal thing by osmosis.

Thanks for all the input above guys! I think I'm narrowing in on what could be good next adds for me. Much appreciated!!

Nice work, and way more restrained than i would have managed, good stuff :)

Garfield, glad my post above gives some helpful input / food for thought.

Sounds to me like you're doing the reports mainly for your own learning process. Makes sense to me.

Yes, lots to chew on, we can pick it up later.

Cheers, NG

I succesfully avoided an scam attempt the past week from a guy living in Rotterdam, be aware of trading with whichever that uses

***@aoutlook.com as a paypal address

There are other users that were scammed for this pig
-- franq

I am aware my response is over a year later. The dude mentioned is still active, I believe mainly on Facebook groups where I read about him several times. He ‘sells’ under several names, so be aware.

EDITED Sep 27th 2022, 15:17

Thanks for checking it out @troux. I was sort of practicing restraint. My natural tendency is for "more". More drums, more transitions, more distortion, more abstract, more more lo-fi, more experimental, more, more, more... Haha.

Well done @farkas, I'm a big fan of exploratory jams and this turned out great.

So in love with this module. Tried a dub-style patch with it:

Full patch notes are in the description.

Growing pains are a real possibility, I'm very new to this.

It's pitch sequencing, I'm struggling to quickly create decent sounding melodies and bass lines. I definitely need more practice, but it feels like even if I were to put in the time to master Metron's Voltera expansion (which is what I've been using for pitch sequencing) I'd still really struggle to do it quickly and easily enough to keep the music satisfactorily interesting. Too many things to do to focus all my time on coming up with the next bit of pitch.

I'll keep playing with it. I'm already loads better off since the beginning of this thread, thanks to all these great suggestions.

Haven't done one of my "android jazz" videos in a while. I was just patching aimlessly this morning and thought I would record something in the vein of some of the recent posts regarding sequencers and live techno setups. This is a fully improvised modular minimal techno jam. No plan, no safety net, no direction home. Nothing groundbreaking, just pressed record to see what would happen. Actually turned out ok. Hope someone might enjoy a little Friday night dance party. Thanks for your time.

Audio only for those who don't want to stare at my twisted visage: https://ciernyvlk.bandcamp.com/track/brief-encounter

EDITED Aug 6th 2021, 18:46

I'm not really familiar with the Metron so I can't speak to it very well @CardiacTasty, but I can share at a high level that on my own journey here sometimes it's not the modules. It's possible that your rack can do a lot of what you want as is and there's some growing pains there? Certainly that has been the case for me at various points along the way. So I'm curious, what exactly are you finding clunky here? What's not working?

I'm using the clock on the Metron itself. It does have a clock in though, so I could possibly use a Polyend Poly 2 to send clock from an external drum machine to the Metron as I don't think the Digitakt or the Octatrack has a clock out port, only midi.

I've been eyeing the Metropolix @troux. It's a tremendously powerful pitch sequencer, and the two voice control is exactly what I'm going for. The issue I keep coming back to: I fail to see how it could interplay with the Metron. I absolutely adore the Metron's 'variations' capability; I love being able to flip to a new musical idea, and then flip back to the original before moving on to something else. With the Metropolix I kind of lose that ability, though it might be true that with this recent change to precision adders generating the pitch sequences I may have already lost that ability.

Though it pains me, maybe I should jump ship from the Metron sequencing nearly everything to an external drum machine sequencing drums while the Metropolix sequences pitch? I love my Metron, but it's definitely proving difficult to integrate certain aspects (in a tasty way).

Yes, there's a little GAS in the tank @farkas 🤣

I just bought a metropolix though I've not had the chance to use it yet, but it seems to be close to what you're looking for?
-- troux

Yay! @troux is back! :)

What are you using as a master clock now? Some drum machines have cv clock inputs and outputs (RD8 and RD9 for example, and I assume the Elektron stuff too).
I’m a bit more excited about modular drums than Ronin, but I agree that the expense and necessity are probably unnecessary for some. I really enjoy my hybrid setup. I have an MPC but don’t really use a lot of samples that I don’t create myself, so I like the versatility of a decent enough drum machine and modular options. I’m usually happy with standard 808/909 sounds but the BIA and WMD modules are fun. I’ve been building some percussion sounds from scratch too, so everyone will do it differently. The MPC One and RD8 also have trigger outputs to interface with the rack. There are a lot of different ways to do the same so just continue to do your research to find the right option for you.

I just bought a metropolix though I've not had the chance to use it yet, but it seems to be close to what you're looking for?

Oh, here's an update on the setup at the current moment. As always, this will change dramatically as I continue twiddling. I took a lot from that video you shared @farkas, particularly around live pitch sequencing. I'm feeling much, much better about generating melodies on the fly now.

EDITED Aug 6th 2021, 17:02

Those are great points about drums in modular @Ronin1973.

My main concern with an external drum machine is something that actually might not matter much (or might matter tremendously): desk space. I'm concerned with being able to fit both my modular case and a separate drum machine on whatever table is available, whether that's at some venue or at home while practicing. I'm also a little concerned with the portability aspects of packing the modular case as well as a case for the drum machine, but that's a more minor concern.

In trialing with the case I currently own (a 104 hp 9u beauty from Case From Lake), I now realize I might actually be able to rock a small drum machine to the right of the case when it's setup. Maybe I should sell my Octatrack and buy a Digitakt?

What do you guys think of mixing separate drum machines and drum machine modules? How would a person get the drum machine sequencing drum modules? Would the drum machine control the clock on the Metron?

...I'm realizing this is going to take more research, but that's nothing new. Thanks again.

EDITED Aug 6th 2021, 16:57

If you like getting deep I enjoy the NerdSeq, I also plan on adding a er-101 just because it looks interesting.

If you dig the classic face value eloquencer and Metron are cool.

-- spacewizardinspace

The NerdSeq is what's known as a "tracker" sequencer... made popular in the 1990s on computers like the Commodore Amiga. There's absolutely nothing wrong with trackers. But the workflow might stymie someone's creativity... depending on the individual.

Hi Ronin1973,

What exactly do you mean by what you just wrote? That the module is diode-protected against connecting the power cable the wrong way? I had played with the idea of that to add that indeed as one of the many parameters to the review report however not all manufacturers mention that in their manual and/or on their website, so would it be clever to add this parameter? Please do let me know and I will seriously consider this.

Or if you meant something else, please let me know in more details what exactly do you mean? Thank you very much in advance and kind regards, Garfield.
-- GarfieldModular

Sorry for the late reply. Yes. Diode protected. Having this information for multiple modules formatted the same way makes looking up information faster and convenient. I think that's a plus for having this sort of documentation. If I can look up basic electronic values... even volt ranges of jacks, all in the same format, your guides become much more useful (assuming that there are enough entries to cover the most popular of modules, etc.).

TipTop's Z4000NS gives you CV control of all four stages of the ADSR at a street price of $175US. I have a couple. They work as advertised. The Doepfer A-140 doesn't have CV control of parameters.

The Befaco is actually quite nice, as there is also a gate output that fires off for EACH stage of ADSR. That could be useful for triggering other modules, sequencers, or ADSRs.

I would want one or two "Gucci" ADSR units for complex envelope generation. Then less expensive BASIC ADSRs if I need more envelope generators that are just doing what's labeled on the tin, like the Doepfer... as they are half as expensive.

I'd buy at least one Befaco if I was doing it again. I find the extra gates per stage to be hella' useful.

There are very few good reasons to put drums in your case. Drum modules are more expensive than buying a drum machine. Those modules will also need additional modules to be cohesive. If you have 8 drum modules going, you're going to need a Eurorack mixer with at least 8 inputs. You will also need a sequencer with 8 triggers available. So it's a substantial investment for something that can be replaced with a $300-$400 external device. Your audience isn't going to care if all of your drums are coming from the case or a drum machine.

There ARE good reasons to have modular drums if modulation is something that's extremely important to your own personal sound in abstract music. But for 99% of people... it's JUST a drum sound.

The 1010 Music BitBox is a good compromise if you want to stay inside the case. It can also be triggered via MIDI if your sequencer supports MIDI OUT. It's possible to run one TRS cable from the sequencer's MIDI out to the BitBox's MIDI in. Without giving a full tutorial on MIDI there are caveats of course.

There are smaller sample playback units that will work just fine as well. I'm speaking of gear I know and I'm familiar with.

Hi dear
I'm googling about an adsr. I'm searching something with CV controller on all parameters.
I stuck in the doubt on: befaco Adsr, Danny sound looping VCADSR or the cheapest Doepfer a-140. Also if a-140 still the cheapest (thinking to DIY for befaco and Danny) how about function and quality?
What you think about this module? All advice is appreciate.

Thanks
Glitched0xff

I like it. Especially how the harsher, snare/snap type sound comes in very occasionally nearer the end of the track. Nice restraint.

Hi,
In the Hemisphere Suite firmware for Ornament and crime there is an app called Captain Midi.
With it the module become a 4 cv to midi and 4 midi to cv interface.

Have a nice day.

Thank you once again Garfield!

Here's what I'm up to:

I use an Antelope Orion32 for the 'heavy lifting' via USB. But I also use a MOTU 828 mkii for CV Tools via Firewire 400. You just have to set up the routings for these properly in whatever software your machine uses for audio multitrack routing.

But yeah, you can run multiple interfaces PROVIDED your DAW and audio routing software can deal with this properly. With Ableton, the DAW certainly doesn't have a problem with that. This is actually a bit similar to the issues one sees when adding an ADAT Lightpipe interface to another interface, then letting the machine know about the new/extra channels. And in fact, depending on what DAW interface you're using, that strategy might be the right one here; you could use one of Expert Sleepers' Lightpipe-equipped modules for that.

Hi Plragde,

Thank you very much for your honest opinion. Just while I was reading your reply, some idea of splitting the document came up to my mind. Let me give that idea some more time to grow and I need to chew on that a bit longer, I just might have found a way to reduce the review report, just looking at the number of pages; roughly reducing it by half. The contents will stay for the moment the same, I guess but I might need to work on that too.

Thanks again, I need to catch some sleep, kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Nickgreenberg,

Wow, thank you very much for your extensive feedback and post! That's very kind of you :-) It's getting late here. I need more time to process your information and give it some thoughts where and how it can help me.

To some of the general information and questions you provide, I can give already some information:

Well... the entire idea of mine to come up with a text-only (but including figures, diagrams, etc.) review report had a good reason, at least to start with like I do it now. I didn't wanted to be the one-thousandth-and-one Youtube reviewer of module X or Y. There are already so many reviewers doing videos that I don't think it would make much sense that I would be just one more person adding videos to Youtube. I still might do that in the mid/far future however it's not planned for the next few years (I think/guess but you never know).

I mean, look at what you already concluded and which I agree with, there are two or three good reviewers, check their Youtube videos and then you have already a certain impression (good or bad) about a certain module. And I was hoping here is where I come in then ;-) Once you are interested in a certain module that you then would check if I would have written a review report about it to check those details that interest you, you don't have to read the entire review report (if you don't like to spend too much time), just those bits and bytes that might interest you or where you want to know more specific/technical information about. Check at least chapter 2 and then whatever parts of the document depending on what kind of information you are looking for. If you miss certain things please do let me know.

There are at least two reasons why I do... let's say the less fancy modules... One is, there are less reviews of those modules on Youtube as well, the other reason and that one is perhaps "what's in it for me" is that I learn from it as well. Creating review reports is for me a kind of way to force myself to go deeper into one particular module, trying to completely understand it, hence only then I am able to create in Visio a flow diagram for paragraph 5.4 and some other stuff that I otherwise wouldn't know or at least not for sure. I also want to start rather with easy and not too complicated functionality because I have to build up experience and I don't want straight away to start with complicated modules. The chance that I would overlook important facts or even would write something that might not be correct at all is then much higher and that's what I want to avoid. If I write a review report of a module, I want and I have to:
- completely understand that module, even if it's only then when I get started with writing the review report
- it needs to be based as much as possible on facts, not emotional feelings or whatsoever, as "clean" and "neutral" as possible, with the exception of course of chapter 2 where I give my own opinion (and a few other paragraphs, see the review report for such exceptions; I mention that clearly so the reader know if it's just my opinion or something fact-base)
- I need to kind of like the module or at least I want to stand behind it what I am writing in the review report
- I want to have used the module for quite some time before getting to start to write a review report

The last reason, is the reason why I asked Farkas (in the here above posts) if he can wait a bit. Yes, I do have that A-103 filter module but because of my new studio setup I had no time at all yet to start use that module. So, I want to build up some experience first before I start to write a review report about it. Now is this module a bit similar (but not the same of course) to the A-124 module of which I already wrote a review report, so I am quite confident that I can write a review report in a rather short time about A-103 as well; hence the reason why I will write one about A-103.

So if I today decide to start writing a review report about the Sinfonion, one of the most complex modules I know then this review report would be from my point of view most likely not going to be complete nor fully correct because that module is so complex you need some serious experience with it before you can analyse a module like that. Naturally there are a bit less complicated modules as well however even a Vector (Five12), a great sequencer but before I am able to write a review report on that one, I need much more experience too. What I am writing in the review reports, as already mentioned, I want to mean that from my heart and I should be able to completely stand behind that what I am writing.

So what's there in for me? To be honest, for the moment not much; close to nothing actually. The above mentioned second reason that it's a learning curve for me too, is most likely the most that there's in for me.

Thus yes, this is mainly labour of love that I am putting in here :-)

Please allow me to read more carefully the details of your detailed feedback, process that and then I will try to come back to you about that. Please do note that I very much appreciate it, I just need more time to reply :-) Thank you very much and kind regards, Garfield.