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Yeah, I agree with you on that. It's good advice. I started my search yesterday with a bit of help from a friend in the mixing/mastering business. The real challenge will be keeping him from buying everything before I get to it. :-)

Hola Cacharrada,

For example Rubadub seems to have Pam's in stock, if that's the question. ModularGrid lists a few sites to purchase modules but not all of them, so sometimes it's worth looking around some more ;-)

Now that I look a bit closely at the rack and Garfield's comments, I second his remark about an extra filter and reiterate the fact that what Pam's can offer in the realm of CV modulation sources is what I feel is missing from the proposed rack. LoL, now I almost feel like I'm selling the thing :-D

Saludos,
Diego

PS: foto de paella -> ahora tengo hambre :-)

I am new to modular, and looking for a good way to get started without knowing exactly what sets of modules I want to start with. I came across the Pico System III Eurorack version and it seemed like it could be a great first module for a Eurorack system, however after searching around (including in this forum) I found very little evidence of ANYONE using this in a Eurorack. I saw some cool demos of the desktop version, but no discussion of it within the Eurorack communities I checked.

Is this something I'd end up wanting to get rid of once I got familiar with Eurorack? It seems cool, but considering I haven't found any evidence of people using it in their Eurorack systems, I feel I would have a hard time selling a eurorack version of it.

Does anyone have any advice on this? Would I be better off getting the desktop version due to the resalability?

Really enjoying this patch, in no small part this is the product of the divided gates coming from the #PittsburghModular #MicroSequence, gates hitting the #ALM #PipSlope (Tweaking the PipSlope to let more of less thru) which is opening up #MutableInstruments #Veils to let through the #MakenoiseSTO and the #2hpARP pattern. The twinkly blippy beats come from the #AddacSystems #Tnetworks103 going through the #2HpVerb. Main beat is also the T-networks with hats percussion coming from the Roland TR-09. The PipSlope also tweaks the #HappyNerding #HNVCF. There is also some of the STO routed through the ADDAC105 and mixed with its output before heading to the #Erica #PicoDSP

And as usual, its time to pull all the plugs and delete the .wav files :)

Thanks @Farkas, now it seems that the issue is te gent one Pam's...

This will be fun, if you have tiny fingers. Otherwise, the micro-modules will get on your nerves at some point, particularly the Marbles clone (Marbles, unlike a lot of similar random-based sequencers, is really playable, and not at its best as a "set-and-forget" sequencer). Otherwise, the lack of VCAs is your only real issue.... you're going to want some. Maybe replace the input module with something like Ears, and use the free 4hp to add a VCA module (there are several dual VCA modules in 4hp available).

One reason I moved to larger, complex oscillators is due to their incredible depth and flexibility. I started out with STO, Dixie, and Plaits. I love each of these little oscillators but wouldn't trade all three for any one of my complex oscillators (Trident, DPO, Odessa, and Telharmonic). Sure, in a smaller case they are sometimes hard to justify, but stick Odessa in this one and it could easily create a powerful generative ambient landscape.

Just my 2 cents.

Hi Mowse,

I am sorry to hear you are facing problems with your mixer :-( I hope you find a solution :-) Buying a new one? ;-)

If wrapping up your EP-420 case is the consequence of this fantastic music, I would like to ask you to keep wrapping up your EP-420 every week or so :-)

It sounds so naturally, so easy going, the music you create, it's amazing and yes, keep on coming with "stuff" like this! Thank you very much for sharing this and kind regards, Garfield.

I think my poor little mixer is giving up the ghost. 10 years of service for a cheap, consumer grade slab isn't too bad, I suppose. :-)
-- mowse

Big suggestion: when you start looking for a replacement mixer, don't start with the new stuff. Instead, hit Reverb, eBay, etc and look for live pro audio desks from roughly 1990-2005. Since the whole concept of digital audio for live work shrunk down the desks, etc used for FOH work, there's a lot of primo stuff for dimes on the dollar out there (he said, leaning on the end bolster of the cherry 54-frame Soundcraft FIVE he got for $800). Seriously, tho...here's just one example of a nice, smaller live desk that would work nicely in a small studio, only $495 + shipping: https://reverb.com/item/34531059-soundcraft-lx7ii-24-channel-mixer?bk=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJqdGkiOiI0NDlhYWQ0OC1mMTFmLTQ1ZTMtYTg4OC1kNTRmNjRhYjIwODciLCJpYXQiOjE1OTY5MzA4MzMsInVzZXJfaWQiOiIiLCJzZXNzaW9uX2lkIjoiIiwiY29va2llX2lkIjoiNGY3NTU5NjItMzc5Mi00NDQzLTk5YWMtYjZhZDk1MjlhOGNmIiwicHJvZHVjdF9pZCI6IjM0NTMxMDU5Iiwic291cmNlIjoiTk9ORSJ9.QkOVR7Sla-YqtL5diOo6MlAvL863pzXa4T6BtfJw10E Nice stuff...back when this was new (which it still IS...see this Sweetwater listing: https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/LX7ii-24--soundcraft-lx7ii-24-channel-mixer) it wasn't too cheap at about $1500. And this is just one example amongst loads...

Nice @jimhowell1970, just gave you a follow!

Hey all, Im building out a nifty case with the intention of having a generative ambient setup which I could also plug the output of piezo mics into rings or clouds, etc. I play Yang Qin (Chinese hammered dulcimer) - Its hard to explain the music I make but i have some stuff out on BC as Earth Person if that helps inform your suggestions. I have 10 hp left in my case and was thinking of the antumbra cara (smaller marbles) does anyone have any suggestions on other modules which might suit the setup better?

I'm definitely going to buy a few modules at a time and then see what I'm missing or where I want to go.

And my bad. That 3:1 is definitely not a mult haha. I meant to put this instead https://afterlateraudio.com/product/mult/. The MI Links look great though. I guess it would be better than the ALA one since I could do mult a stereo in, and still have space free for more inputs. Perhaps I'll have one ALA mult, and one links. Does this seem like a good idea?

EDITED Aug 8th 2020, 20:53

Another question, any recommended cable brands to get or stay away from. I know this is a bit of personal preference but with so many to choose from, any go to sources great value/price ratio are welcome.

well good luck with that I don't have particularly large hands and I definitely prefer bigger modules with larger knobs and more space between the knobs and jacks - but each to their own

go slowly buy a few modules at a time - that way you can answer these questions yourself - it's your synth - if you can get similar functionality to links from other modules (and you prefer those other modules) then do so - personally I always find it useful to have a buffered mult etc etc

yeah the bored brains things will work, but you'll probably want a few, easily loose them, drop them on the floor and step on them, spill coffee on them etc...

EDITED Aug 8th 2020, 19:35

That’s the goal, I want to experiment and grow the second row after I am better able to decide what is missing coming from a more informed desire to fill a gap. All the guidance has been great and much appreciated. I don’t want to fall into analysis paralysis but looking for a solid foundation that forces creative use of limited mods.

If you are going to get a Mantis (great case btw, I have 1) then it really doesn't matter as you will have space left over anyway, ochd is a fine octal lfo, but in a small case with other modulation I think links is slightly more useful

to me really it comes down to this - buy a few modules - play with them - once you know them inside out, get another and repeat, within one or two modules you will work out which modules you need anyway

Thanks Jim. I thought about getting the full size ones, but smaller knobs don't really bother me too much as my hands aren't that big. Plus, I figured I could save a little money that way.

Good call on the kinks. Do I need the links if I have the 3:1 mixer? Or should I grab two 3:1 mixers? Couldn't I also use this https://www.perfectcircuit.com/boredbrain-splix-black.html as a not so pretty way of doing it as well? I didn't think about the matrix mixer though. That's a good suggestion.

Also, I forgot to mention I have a Mackie VLZ802 I'd be using as an outboard mixer to go to my interface.

I will likely get a mantis case so I have room to grow but want to limit my first rack to a single row. With that being said I could take out the mmf, lxd, and hpo as you suggested originally Jim and put the mixer back. The ochd looks really nice but if you think links is more versatile with maths I could go that route. So many options but a good exercise and I appreciate all the feedback.

More filters or mixer, links vs ochd decisions decisions

Got the modules from @RazzoRocket & @yrn1 a little while ago. Seamless transactions & quick to dispatch. Thanks!

EDITED Aug 8th 2020, 18:42

personally I would have fewer sound sources and get full size ones so that they are easier to play with

but more seriously, I would dump the ochd - pams and maths (plus pachinko) is enough modulation in this size case imo - instead use utility modules, such as mutable links and kinks and a matrix mixer to derive lots of related modulation

if you look around enough (2 mins on google) you'll find a pulse from make noise that you can just copy in an audio track and then place it on every beat and play that out at full volume on a spare audio channel - this works even if you don't have a dc coupled audio interface - I do and I still use this method

or you could use midi clock and a midi->cv module

Some thoughts from a relative noobie, but I'd probably swap the Links for an Ochd, I like a lot of potential modulation sources and Ochd's ratios are really nice even if you only use a few outs, this would let you use the Maths in some more interesting ways too. If I was going to pick a different filter I'd choose a Polaris, I like the sound a lot more than the new Ripples, it's more playable, and it has a lot more features. You'd have 2hp to fill there which is a lot less than 4 but might still give you some interesting options.

re ochd - I think 1 modulation source in a case this size is enough - kinks and links together with the matrix mixer provide enough useful utility modules to leverage Maths to suffice all the modulation requirements - ochd (or similar, maybe something with reset) would be a great early addition to the next rack, imo

I like the idea of swapping the filter for ripples or polaris!

On another note @JimHowell1970 I hope we see some video work from you one day, that rack looks incredible!
-- troux

https://www.instagram.com/jimhowell1970 - enjoy

the case is more logical than physical - it's not all in one case, chromagnon is on order and the bottom 2 rows are my wish list - as is the fortress and diver is in for repair

EDITED Aug 8th 2020, 17:28

Looking pretty sharp @mog00!

any help would be appreciated

Recently got modules from @yrn1 and @atomtwist.
Everything ok, flawless transactions and prompt shipments.

Hey all,

This is what my first setup is looking like so far. I'm trying to do generative ambient music. I still have 18 hp left, but I'm not sure what I want to do with it yet. How does this setup look so far? Thanks!

troux Orchd great choice!. All these recommendations have been great thank you.

Latest iteration

Some thoughts from a relative noobie, but I'd probably swap the Links for an Ochd, I like a lot of potential modulation sources and Ochd's ratios are really nice even if you only use a few outs, this would let you use the Maths in some more interesting ways too. If I was going to pick a different filter I'd choose a Polaris, I like the sound a lot more than the new Ripples, it's more playable, and it has a lot more features. You'd have 2hp to fill there which is a lot less than 4 but might still give you some interesting options.

On another note @JimHowell1970 I hope we see some video work from you one day, that rack looks incredible!

I think my poor little mixer is giving up the ghost. 10 years of service for a cheap, consumer grade slab isn't too bad, I suppose. :-)

Apparently still trying to debug this mixer right/left balance issue. Thought I had it pegged but in reality I think this poor little mixer is finally giving up the ghost after ten years. Anyhow...

Wrapped up the final touches on the EP-420 case migration early this morning, moving a few modules and cleaning up the internal wiring. Later this afternoon, I had a 30 minute window between meetings and managed to jam out this fun little patch that brings in one of my Moog Mother 32's. Hope you enjoy it.

In agreement with what has been said so far and just wanted to drop in a note about the Joranalogue Filter 8: It's complicated.

I know this filter has been getting a lot of praise and has been placed on several "Top 10 modules" lists. I have owned one for about six months. It's a very powerful filter that craves lots of modulation to get the most out of it. If you're just starting out, I'd suggest a filter or two of simpler design. With that 12hp of space, you could have something like the new Mutable Instruments Ripples v2 or a Doepfer A-124 Wasp (classic AND cheap) plus a Steady State Fate MMF pingable VCF or even a Make Noise LxD (low pass gate). This would open the door to lots of creative sound plus a friendly learning curve.

Joranalogue Filter 8, terrific module but big for this case and complicated for someone just getting into modular/eurorack.

Just my 2 cents. :-)

Thanks Jim! Being a noob picking modules is like staring into the sun, and I am only getting started.

revised kit

As always all comments, suggestions are welcome, I am super grateful for the help.

@wtkdwc recomended seller, fast shipping etc. everything as described so thanks again, Michaela !

I agree with pretty much everything Jim said. I think when starting out having a disting (mk4 or EX) would be really helpful. It lets you fill in any holes you have in your rack and experiment with a bunch of different things that you can do in eurorack. All of a low footprint and a single price.

Looks bang on, thank you!

I would remove the adsr, the dsp, the quad lfo and rosie

do you really need an adsr? generally these are pretty much set and forget so 2hp work really well - or if you need something more variable sellf patch maths - see illustrated manual - if you really need a 'complex' adsr - I'm sure you can find another one that is a nice even 6hp so that you can upgrade the pico dsp to the happy nerding fx aid

the pico dsp is based on the same chip as the fx aid - but the fx aid however is much more versatile - you can swap the programs and can do both stereo in stereo out and mono in stereo out

you have Maths as a modulation source - which imo is enough in this size case - see below on how to make it go further

in my opinion Rosie is pretty pointless and takes up a lot of space for what it is - either use the vca or the effect module as a final stage and listen in mono or the effect module as a final stage and listen in stereo - use a 2hp headphone module if you specifically need headphones - if you desperately want a crossfader you can patch it with maths - see illustrated manual

that would save you 30hp

with that I would put in -
6hp - an original plaits - much more ergonomically friendly
2hp - 2hp headphone module
4hp - fx aid - much more versatile than the pico dsp (and an even size!)
8hp - mutable links and kinks - incredibly useful beginner starter set - adds a buffered mult, 2 utility mixers*, a rectifier, basic logic and a sample and hold - these are all incredibly useful in terms of both audio and (particularly in a small case like this) cv - you can use a minimal amount of modulation - ie Maths - and extend it in many different ways - to produce a further 7 related modulation sources (helps if you get some stackcables for this!) just from kinks

and then either

10hp - AISynthesis matrix mixer - just because matrix mixers rock - AISynthesis seem like a great company - and it fits in 10hp!

or

2hp - 2hp adsr - if you really need an adsr
8hp - doepfer quad vca - because you can never have too many vcas

or

8hp - disting ex - incredibly useful in any sized case - especially for beginners to work out what modules actually do
2hp - 2hp adsr or even better vca

or

4hp - disting mk4 - really useful in any size case - especially for beginners to work out what modules actually do
6hp - leave blank until disting tells you what to put there

Firmware images can be found on our website.

We recommend to upgrade as soon as possible for best experience.

Install instructions:
1. Power on 2.4SINK Eurorack module in WiFi access point mode
2. Make sure no sensors are connected
(either wait 10 minutes until sensors go to sleep or take out batteries)
and no Ableton Link enabled device is in the same WiFi network
3. Access web app with a web browser (http://2-4sink.local/ or http://192.168.5.1/)
4. Click firmware upload button and select firmware binary 2.4SINK-vX.X.X.bin
5. Wait until upload progress has finished and module has rebooted automatically
6. OPTIONAL: Verify firmware version in web app below upload button

ATTENTION! ALL SETTINGS INCLUDING WIFI, BLUETOOTH AND MAPPINGS WILL BE DELETED AFTER FIRMWARE UPGRADE!

After successful upgrade, the module starts WiFi in access point mode with default settings (SSID: 2.4SINK, no password).

By default, all outputs of Bank B are configured for Ableton Link after upgrade
(clock for full/quarter beat clock and LFOs with different waveforms synced to single beat).

CHANGELOG

v1.1.0-beta2
Bug Fixes:
- Fixed firmware crash if many Bluetooth devices are in the near
- Fixed Bluetooth MIDI connection loss

v1.1.0-beta1
New Features:
- Ableton Link (including customizable clock divider and synced LFOs for each output)

Improvements:
General:
- Up to seven Movesense motion sensors can be used in Wi-Fi client mode now
- Higher randomness for stepped noise LFO

Performance:
- Improved performance of Movesense motion sensors
- Improved performance of web app
- Overall stability and performance improvements

Usability:
- Direction of acceleration axes match graphics on sensor
- Gate/Triggers based on acceleration are debounced to prevent unwanted triggers
- Yaw axis value increases when turning right (inversed direction)
- Removed netmask and gateway field in web app for WiFi access point settings
- Status LED is now flickering if motion sensors are connected (depending on number of sensors, the frequency increases)
- Status LED becomes brighter representing the upload progress during firmware upgrade (if firmware upgrade was successful, status LED blinks five times)

Bug Fixes:
- Fixed disconnect of Movesense motion sensors when changing CV settings via web app
- Fixed non reconnect of Movesense motion sensors when rebooting module
- Fixed disconnect and non reconnect when using more than four Movesense motion sensors
- Fixed wrong mode when changing and saving output mode gate via web app
- Fixed phase offset of some LFOs

v1.0.0
Initial firmware

This is my plan for an initial build around the Neutron. My budget is ~$3000 and my goal is something that allows for a lot of sound design for sampling while being immediately performable and at the same time having the possibility of, though not specializing in, generative stuff.

The Neutron was really good at sound design and generative all alone and I learned a lot using it (I even got pseudo-euclidean rhythms by putting the 2 oscs in lfo mode, turning on sync, and playing with the delay!). For now I just want to cover its missing aspects and expand it. The intellijel 7u cases are carry-on compatible and I will be traveling in the near future so that's why I'm choosing that case. I have already owned the neutron for about a year, and aside from traveling it will not be racked, giving me some room to grow. I always run out of attenuators, vcas, and envelopes while patching the neutron, so that's why those modules are there. Also a sequencer capable of transforming one instrument into a completely different one over the course of a performance, and that can also handle triplets, record cv, and do a bit of sampling is why I chose the nerdseq over the hermod and metron. Initially I was gonna give the nerdseq mutes with an addac latch module, but I learned a launchpad gives it that functionality as well as x0x and clip-firing style flexibility so I nixed that module, at least for now even though it would still be useful for other things like hocketting. It will connect to the disting ex via i2c (when that expander is soon released), which gives multi-velocity, note, and round robin autosampling and polyphonic sample playback, which is really awesome and will make a great seq/samp duo, as well as a looper and other utilities for experimentation. The disting midi breakout is there as a price/hp placeholder for the nerdseq i2c breakout module. The 2xMIXIV modules replace the ATN8 I think for the better. I found them because the atn8 is not available right now and I'm thinking of purchasing soon. The faders are probably a bit more usable than the trim pots on the ATN8, and it ends up consuming the same hp. I have lots of attenuator/mixer/vcas because setting up, for example, a reverb that ducks the attack of a lead patch takes 3 vcas alone. Assuming 3 voices and a sampled bass that I want auto-ducked, that's another 3 vcas plus 3 attenuators for separate duck levels of each of those 3 voices. That's 6 vcas. Etc. So lots of vcas. Also I have at least 5 stackable cables already.

I want the ability to make an actual 'track', as well as the ability to set up self playing patches. I've gotten some really cool stuff regarding the latter out of the Neutron alone, but when it comes to an actual track the amount of computer involved in sampling and performing really kills the workflow. I like the Seq24 line of sequencers but they are kind of unstable, and this build addresses those issues.

The (not)'full' build plan is here:

Eventually working towards tzfm and quad(oct)rature play (formants, morphing, more performability) from modules included here (ignore the hermod and bitbox. That functionality is replaced by the nerdseq and disting):

If I find out the new Nerdseq P will be given a CV input expander then I'll save the rackspace and go that route instead, but otherwise I'm eyeing a b-stock demo nerdseq for a purchase soon.

Thanks in advance for all advice!

EDITED Aug 7th 2020, 10:11

re @boombipbass ... I never had any transaction or interaction whatsoever with this member but just saw that I got thumbs down from him. WTF???!! I messaged him just a minute ago asking why the hell but now I see it's unlikely that I'll get any reply from him.

Update: days later he did reply and removed the thumbs down.

EDITED Nov 26th 2020, 13:45

Hi Mowse,

I am glad you found the issue being a design flaw :-) I look forward in hearing your next track!

Kind regards, Garfield.

To be used with the Behringer 84HP rack/power supply combo.
Awesome external $500 sequencer build

Given your wants, Mimetic Digitalis might be one to consider.

Pretty green when it comes to modular, but have been doing a ton of research, just putting together a rack to get started exploring the foundations of modular. Let me know what you think, suitable substitutions or better options. I have limited my initial exploration to 104HP.

EDITED Aug 6th 2020, 18:04

Yes, I have to vouch for Pam's New Workout too. I don't really enjoy menu-diving either, but Pam's is the glue that holds my rack together. It's pretty easy to use, and usually set and forget for my patches. Highly recommended early in your modular journey.
Have fun and good luck!

Thanks guys for your feedback.

@toodee It seems I should have a look to Pam’s. I’ve seen plenty of videos of it, seems powerful but complicated... After your comments suppose is better to change Erica’s Black clock for Pam’s.

@GarfieldModular Great advice... I will start with the basics... but I wanted to start with the melodicer to have at least some sequencer or rhythm generator, and not just cool sounds and modulation. Maybe I can start with Pams for that?

Thanks again for your help.

Hi all,

I'm fairly new to the world of modular but have got a setup I'm reasonable happy with, only thing I would like to add is a sequencer module that allows for quick short (8-16) step patterns.

I've been looking at the Varigate 4+ as it allows quite a lot of randomisation features (missing steps etc) is there anything similar to this to create short loops with lots of little variables.

Thanks

Nice experimental sounds! That Odessa (got one too) is really one of the most versatile OSCs in modular out there. Waiting for more to come, mowse :)!

Thanks for the kind words, as always. I checked things over and found that I had nudged a setting on my Zoom recorder. That would explain the left channel bias. I wouldn't have noticed on the monitors since they happen earlier in the chain. Gotta fix that design flaw. :-)

Thanks! That actually is really good advice. I’ll see what I can come up with before jumping off the deep end.

I have been experimenting with O_C and DFAM as well using the quantermain applet. Basically I had a trigger signal patched into TR1 and I set the scales of each of the 4 quantizers, set in turing machine mode to put out voltages that could modulate various DFAM parameters. The key I found is to tweak the octave setting to get an response from DFAM.