Hi there!
Any thoughts on my first rack if I want to move towards more generative patching capabilities? I have some HP left and will definitely add a filter module (I'm currently using an external Behringer TD-3-MO ...), but does anybody has a suggestion for the remaining HP? Thanks in advance!
Cheers, Ben
(Just because it’s more comfortable to see the setup in the thread itself. Simple copy/paste of the rack url).
'On ne devrait jamais quitter Montauban' (Fernand Naudin).
Three first areas for reflection:
A filter, you’re right, rather stereo and not too wide because of your current case (e.g. Dual Dagger, Zagrzeb, Polaris).
An attenuator or attenuverter, Basimilus and others will really need it... (e.g. Sinc Defero, 3x Mia).
A random, for 'generative capabilities' (e.g. Turing Machine, Wogglebug).
Other people here, more expert than I, will modify or complete these initial suggestions.
'On ne devrait jamais quitter Montauban' (Fernand Naudin).
Hi iben,
I asked the same question 2 years ago, and got some great advice from some power users and a suggested setup that really helped direct my rack planning: https://www.modulargrid.net/forum/posts/index/10559.
One of the pieces of advice I got was simply, "nothing about this screams generative to me - how are you expecting to generate random sequences? and modify them over time?"
Part of doing generative music (to me, this is opinion, after all) is using the modules to set up the conditions, restraints, and rules that direct and filter generated randomness into something evolving and (controllably) unpredictable. Unfortunately, doing so often takes a lot of support modules, and with a Rackbrute, there isn't much space to get generative. So my thoughts are that you should be looking at:
1) Sources of randomness. Maybe I'm wrong, but it doesn't seem like you have enough ability to create random voltage sequences. PAMs can do this well in several flavors (random and smooth random), but I find that those 8 outputs get used up fast for other clocking duties. I really enjoy my TipTop/Buchla Source of Uncertainty, but it is regrettably huge. Instruo just put out a new Tagh, which gives multiple types of random in 4 hp. @Sweelinck's suggestion of Turing Machine or Wogglebug are also great. However, maybe consider the uOrnament and Crime, which has different shift register/turing machine appletts, along with a couple of dozen other utility uses. And which brings us to Point 2.
2) Utilities to ontrol the randomness. Well, obviously someone was going to say utilities. But there are a few in particular that you might want to consider that really help me when doing generative.
* Comparators - These send out voltages when a certain threshold is met, or in the case of window comparators, when a voltage is within/without a certain range. For example, sending an LFO through and having gates come out when the LFO crosses a certain threshold. I love Joranalogue's Compare 2 for this, and the DivKid video on it goes into depth about how comparators work in general.
* Sample and hold - Gosh I love these. I'll often send a smooth random signal into one of these and sample at rhythmic intervals to develop my melodies. There are a ton of great ones, but I've really been enjoying After Later Audio's SHTH, which gives you both sample and hold and track and hold, and a few other goodies, in 2hp.
* Attenuators/attenuverters/inverters - My god, a random voltage generator really means random, and that often sounds like crap. So you'll want to attenuate the randomness, or the LFO, or the other cv, or frankly any signal because I just can't think of much that an attenuator/attenuverter/inverter can't help with. PAMS can do this, as well, but again with the limited outputs. A matric mixer like the Doepfer A-138m can be large, but quite useful. I like the Happy Nerding 3x MIA quite a lot, but getting to zero can be tricky on an attenuverter as compared to a pure attenuator. Frap Tools 321 gives you a lot of other functions, as well, but can attenuate and invert nicely. Additionally, you can also use VCAs as attenuators, if you have VCAs to spare...
* VCAS - Guess what, you don't have VCA's to spare. I find that I always want at least one more VCA than whatever number I currently have. A cascading VCA is great, but there are plenty of small VCAs out there to toss in where you have spare hp.
* Quantizer - Perhaps the Varigate can do this? I am not too familiar with it. However, if not, you'll want to be able to quantize your random voltages, because as stated earlier, randomness can sound like crap if not tamed. There are several good ones out there, but to be honest, I've not tried them other than the Dual Quantizer applet on uO_C hemispheres. But that works like a charm. I've heard people love Intellijel's Scales, which is relatively small.
3) A few honorable mentions:
* LFOs - something like Instruo/DivKid's OCHD gives a lot of organic motion in 8 related triangle LFOs.
* Mults - If you're going to be sending multiple copies of a 1v/oct signal, you will want to use Buffered or Active mults, instead of passive ones. The Frap Tools 333 is one such that provides a ton of secret uses. Doepfer's Swtched Multiple A-182-1 (passive, but amazing) is really cool, too.
* uOrnaments and Crime or Disting Super EX - A mutli-utility module that will give you access to a ton of functionality you don't otherwise have room for. Menu diving can be an issue, but they're worth the hp and scrolling in a small system.
* Mutes, routers, shifters, and switches - Don't forget that even with generative music, you'll want to play your instrument. I really enjoy fiddling with DivKid's Mutes, vpme.de's T43 Frequency shifter, and Instruo's tain and (1)F for these purposes.
Hope that helps, best of luck!
(Edited to add that I forgot PAMS can quantize signals as well, if needed, and for spelling, since I apparently need more coffee.)
That helped a lot, thank you so much!
So, thinking about it a bit, I've come up with this. More experienced users please feel free to fix what's lacking/wrong!
First off, little known secret is that the 6U Rackbrute is actually 89 hp for some reason (at least, mine is). Blessed be extra hp.
I've tried to keep all of the modules you already had, except one, since I assume you already own them. I've removed Brains because it's big for what it does, and switched in a Klavis Twin Waves MKII which sounds awesome and is much smaller. All other modules are kept, but rearranged (my own preference and workflow reflected here, nothing particular about their arrangment).
Top row has Pams and the PPEXP-1 which gives you dedicated outs for regular clock, allowing you to do more interesting rhythms or voltages with the original outputs (including random, smooth random, quantized, logic, euclidean, etc...). Then your oscillators, followed by a gnarly dual/stereo filter, the Ikarie. I finish off with your envelope generator and FX.
Bottom row adds some random flavor - the highly compact Tagh to give you random voltages, the SHTH to help pick off voltages, LFOs, and a 2hp VCA, since modulating modulators is fun and you had the room to spare. Your sequncer and more LFOs follow, then the mult, 6 chainable attenuverters, and then the uO_C. I found that getting an uO_C was the primary stepping stone into generative. The shift register and quantizer are just a delight together. The other utilities presented will give you a taste of what else is out there and how to use them, so if/when you get a bigger system, you'll already have experience.
Then the Frap Tools 321 for more voltage/audio futzing, then your VCA, Mixer, and Outs. Eezy peezy.
It's not perfect, but it's a start towards generative so you can decide when you want to do with your system when you (inevitably) expand your system. Should be fun to play, at least.
Best of luck!
Lots of interesting thoughts and good suggestions from @HGsynth.
But be careful, you should not ideally exceed 640mA on +12V and on -12V (per each row) in a RackBrute 6U, that is to say 80% of the 800mA available (for +12V and the same for -12V, there are four separate circuits of 800mA in two rows): and this in order to leave enough headroom for voltage peaks!
However the data sheet of the rack proposed here (in MG) indicates 743mA on the row2 (for +12V), which would be very risky...
Also, you only have 12 slots in the row2, and I see here 13 modules.
'On ne devrait jamais quitter Montauban' (Fernand Naudin).
Wow, I'm speechless of all your great and detailed feedback/ideas! I will dive into the details of all the (unknown) modules before I send out my orders ... maybe you are interested in my first semi-generative patch here on youtube. Thanks again!
Hi guys!
After your feedback I haved added OCHD and Ikarie to my rack. Both are graet! Interested in the result? Enjoy!
Cheers, Ben
Ochd, Ikarie: two great choices.
I listened to your generative piece. It seems you were moving quickly in the right direction.
Perfect!
'On ne devrait jamais quitter Montauban' (Fernand Naudin).
Lots of interesting thoughts and good suggestions from @HGsynth.
But be careful, you should not ideally exceed 640mA on +12V and on -12V (per each row) in a RackBrute 6U, that is to say 80% of the 800mA available (for +12V and the same for -12V, there are four separate circuits of 800mA in two rows): and this in order to leave enough headroom for voltage peaks!
However the data sheet of the rack proposed here (in MG) indicates 743mA on the row2 (for +12V), which would be very risky...Also, you only have 12 slots in the row2, and I see here 13 modules.
-- Sweelinck
physical location does not necessarilly need to reflect where power is plugged in... longer power cables are available (& easily made)
"some of the best base-level info to remember can be found in Jim's sigfile" @Lugia
Utility modules are the dull polish that makes the shiny modules actually shine!!!
sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation sources < utilities
@JimHowell1970
You are absolutely right. That’s why, for example, I plugged the ADDAC207 and the Fold 6 on my row 3, while they are physically screwed (and therefore seem installed) on row 4 in my second RackBrute. See the link.
We are all here to share and remember each other the right practices :)
'On ne devrait jamais quitter Montauban' (Fernand Naudin).
Lot's of really good advice here. I've been going at the generative stuff for 3+ years now and other than the general rule of creating modulation and ways to trigger events from it (comparators) IMO the real key lies in the ability to 'tune' the randomness - i.e. lots and lots of attenuation + offset.
Looking at your rack so far, I'd say it really needs random sources and ways to tune it.
For modules, a few more recommendations:
Caudal from Vult. Soon to be released in physical form (it's a module in VCV rack currently). It will provide two rows four smooth randon voltage outputs. Each row can be clocked to give stepped random output (S/H) and all in 1oHP.
S/H: RND STEP from SSF/Divkid. 3 cascading S/Hs but gives uni and bi-polar outputs - uni so you can use it better for sound sculpting.
Zadar from Xaoc. Says it's an envelope generator but it's not - it's an LFO machine that's particularly good for generative in that you can loop them and CV one paramter for each of the 4 LFOs (2 if you get the 3HP expander and totally worth it).
AxB+C from Befaco. My favorite module for attentuation and offset. Also a ring mod. The dials just make it really easy for me - especially for dialing in LFOs or smooth random that then go on to feed into a function generator for Krell patches. I have a Caudal protype with a Befaco on either side for this very purpose :)
