That’s it…feeling pretty good about my rack…I only own the DFam and PNW so I’m planing my next purchase. Figured another voice…Plaits…then a quantizer and Bloom…but in this setup…do I need maths?

nobody NEEDS maths - at least not the module, but it is pretty handy to have around - in that it does a lot of things - please refer to the 'maths illustrated supplement' for more details - defintely get this module or a similar one (DUSG/falistri/rampage) if you are interested in synthesis as opposed to making sounds with a synthesizer (it helps massively with that too)

I'd want more utilities - but then I always do - mixers, vcas, switches, inverters etc etc - these are the dull inexpensive modules that keep the expensive shiny ones shiny!

of all the modules to remove from the case the obvious one to me is the dfam - it has it's own case and putting it in a eurorack costs extra money to house it & the hp could be used for modules that actually need rack space

not convinced on the need for the quantizer - bloom has a quantizer built in as does pams as does dfam iirc (which may need a converter too - if so there is one in disting)

black hole dsp takes up a lot of space - fx aid (xl) is much smaller and similar in function - whilst being more versatile

Utility modules are the inexpensive, dull polish that makes the expensive, shiny modules actually shine!!!

Thanks for the detailed response. I keep gong back and forth between maths and some version like rampage. Starting new I really like the idea of a dedicated module to do a specific task but that gets expensive and take up a lot of space. I figure I’m gonna take out dfam once I fill up the case but right now it look better then an empty hole. I get what you are saying about utilities. This rack will sure change as I add little by little. Loving how much more I can do with the dfam with just PNW. I’m using the quantizer on PNW now but was not loving using a cv input for it. But that premature cause I don’t have many modules yet. I did not know about dfam iirc…I’ll do some research.
And as for Fx aid…that looks amazing…already threw that in my modulargrid case.
Thanks again! The modular community has been super awesome and very helpful.

Actually, one of the more interesting modulation pairings I've been tossing into builds as of late is the Maths with the Quadrax/Qx from Intellijel. The Quadrax is a 2 or 3-stage EG that can loop and have CV over rise and fall, and with the Qx it also outputs "end of X" pulses. Now, since the Maths can use those "end ofs", and also since the Qx can be used to "cascade" the Quadrax with as many EGs in the cascade as you prefer, that gives you some elaborate AND CVable modulation that pairs very nicely with how the Maths deals with its own rise/falls. Crosspatching those two is definitely a "the sum is more than its parts" situation! Then add to that something like Tiptop's MISO or Frap's 321 and a couple of linear, DC-coupled VCAs, and you'll then have a modulation monster!

And yeah, the DFAM doesn't belong in there. Even if you have open space in the cab after removing it, I'd go ahead and do that, as you don't want to be in the habit of having the DFAM in there and using it in there as well. It's a rather expensive mistake, actually...if you want to see how expensive, take the cost of the cab, divide that by the amount of hp it can hold, and then you'll have your cost-per-hp. Multiply this x60, and that's the hidden "extra" cost of cabbing the DFAM in here. Seriously...put it back in its case, and use the Eurorack cab for things with NO power and NO case.

Oh man…so much to think about. I dropped those modules in. I really like the Frap 321. I have to wrap my head around all of it. With the few modules I have…I go through the phase of just plugging things in and seeing what happens…to figuring out why that’s happening and then applying that knowledge to doing something planed out. I’m gonna have to take everyone’s advice and take out the DFAM. This has been super helpful. Gets me exploring other modules. Thanks!!!!

If you are really new to this and as you say "go through the phase of just plugging things in and see what happens" I'd suggest you may benefit from an oscilloscope.

It's one of those modules that you may think unnecessary, but time and again I've seen even seasoned modular fanatics benefit from being able to visually see what their CV is doing.

Wrapping your head around the actual working functions of things will help you better approach your build as well, IMO, YMMV.

You could get something small, like the Intellijel oscilloscope, or the Mordax DATA if you want to have the absolute best, and could always sell it down the line when you feel more confident in anticipating what each module will do when you patch it.

As to MATHS, it's giant, but it does afford a lot of opportunities, as long as you are willing to sit with it. Just off the top of my head, combined with DFAM, you would be able to achieve a great many rhythmic modulations with just that module, paired with Pam's you will be surprised at the variety, and as someone mentioned, paired with another function generator as well you'd have a never-ending way of creating modulating patterns and timbres.

Get more VCA's than you think you need as well.

Cool! I was trying to fit the Intellijel oscilloscope in the beginning and was worried that I'd get stuck needing to visualize everything instead of just hearing it. But as I play with PNW I do fall into the trap of just turning a knob and hoping it does something I like. Because of that approach I may be just passing that sweet spot because I miss hearing what happens. An oscilloscope would help.
As much as I want to fill up this case, it has been nice to just have the DFAM and PNW. Play around and then reset.

Think I am gonna get Maths. I just keep hearing how it never really gets used and people don't dive deep into it, but that's not the fault of the module.
Thanks for all the advice!

maths being 'underused' is due to the user not the module

to prevent this:


and rtf 'maths illustrated supplement'

and especially work your way through the 'maths illustrated supplement' a good few times - possibly each. time you get a new module

BUT this does raise a philosophical question - if you have a module and you don't use everything it can do, but use it constantly for what you do use it for, are you under using the module? personally I think no - & it's more important to know what the module can do and be able to access any relevant information easily (pdf on phone or laptop is easy enough) for the times when you do want to use it for something else rather than know every single thing the module can do inside and out

Utility modules are the inexpensive, dull polish that makes the expensive, shiny modules actually shine!!!

and rtf 'maths illustrated supplement'

and especially work your way through the 'maths illustrated supplement' a good few times - possibly each. time you get a new module

-- JimHowell1970

+1 on the maths illustrated supplement...i have been going through at least one of the lessons each day since I got Maths to try to understand all that it can do...and in some cases had to go back over one or two of them to really grasp on to what was happening...more so because I'm very new to modular in general.


Not really. I use Quadrax and Batumi for modulation and have plenty of function generator features in these two modules.

I am planing and hope to learn each of these modules well. I have a Digitakt (which got me into modular) I love it but find myself nitpicking over samples and then searching for new samples too much and wanted to start making those sounds myself. The wonderful thing right now is having a limited amount of modules is I really have to figure out what I can actually do and what each module is good at. (Where with the Digitakt...if I want to throw in a lfo...its a button and I move on) I'm sure I'll go throw some modules figuring out what works best for me. Will keep researching and decide on the right module...whether it be Maths or some version of it. Thanks everyone.

Not really. I use Quadrax and Batumi for modulation and have plenty of function generator features in these two modules.
-- sacguy71

How does Batumi or Quadrax deal with slew limiting? Attenuverting? Mixing? Etc? Yes... there is a little overlap comparing those two to Maths. But it's not enough to say you can use those two to cover the functionality of Maths.